Poll: Should admins post a specific player's info publicly?

[Freeyorp101]

This thread is about nonsense that I'm pretending is distinct from the flamewar thread, just so I can get around the limitation of one flaming thread.

FTFY

Good grief. o11c, this is the sort of thing I've been pointing out for a while now. I don't think anyone could imagine any of the original project leaders posting something like that. While mostly harmless, this sort of thing really doesn't leave a good impression. In a way, I suspect this is the very point that is being made here.

The point was clearly not about that. It was about whether admins should be using this data, or any data, to offer punishments and deletions, even if cleverly disguised as helpful services. You seem like a fair minded person who reads, Freeyorp, are you honestly telling me that after reading this thread, and the poll question, that was not obvious?

That was not my original impression, no. However, that's in the past, and we have a well defined topic to stand on now.

I think that everyone has been drawn in by the flame war and needs to back off for a while. The posts in question are ambiguous, but I do see how they could be read as threats.


How about a week where everyone just agrees to stop posting to anything related to any of the currently heated topics, think about things, and perhaps get some work done in the meantime?

I suspect the stress of the move has burnt a lot of people out, and people aren't able to discuss things as civilly as they could right now. A week where everyone can just get back to the core of making a game for fun. We can always come back to things afterwards, hopefully with clear, well defined positions. We can then try to figure out where the great difference began, and perhaps finally sort everything out once and for all.


---Freeyorp

[Len]

today it was me, Garret, and Len

How do I factor into this exactly?

[blackrazor]

today it was me, Garret, and Len

How do I factor into this exactly?

http://forums.themanaworld.org/viewtopi ... &start=272

At this point I say just wipe both servers and nobody can complain about who owns what.

+1

Are you requesting that we delete your data from themanaworld.org? Please be clear and specific.

Blackrazor, you haven't played the game since a few weeks after the server move. Are you concerned that if you log in, that would imply consent for us to retain your data?

The purpose of this game is to have fun. If someone is upset that their accounts are on this server, I will do my best to help. Any request to delete must meet the same criteria as a regular password request (send from the registered email address).

Len, I bolded the part where Frost presumably answered both you and Garrett. You can review the link, to see the original for yourself.

[Cassy]

Len, I bolded the part where Frost presumably answered both you and Garrett. You can review the link, to see the original for yourself.

I really don't want to accuse you to be a troll like others did (though I thought that a few times too), so I rather believe that you totally, and I mean *totally*, misunderstood that part.

[blackrazor]

Len, I bolded the part where Frost presumably answered both you and Garrett. You can review the link, to see the original for yourself.

I really don't want to accuse you to be a troll like others did (though I thought that a few times too), so I rather believe that you totally, and I mean *totally*, misunderstood that part.

Len asked me a question, so I answered it. You seem to think that sentence I bolded means something completely different than how I understood it, so please be specific and explain what you think it really means.

Trolling is like when MadCamel calls a woman a "raging thundercunt" or when Dyna writes about how much they hate a certain person, or when Tux9th asks to have a fellow player banned because he doesn't like to read what that person writes, but apparently lacks the self-control to just ignore it, if it offends him so.

I have done none of these things. Granted, my opinions are unpopular here, but I have made them in the appropriate places and without hate and vitriol. I have written that I have respect for many of the people involved (in their original roles, for which they were well suited), written kind sincere things about their original work (not only criticisms of more recent events), and have only responded most strongly to attacks made upon me personally, including friendly offers to have my presence here (or in the game) deleted. Note that in the game, I have not said a word about any of this nor have I caused even the slightest disruption.

[Cassy]

I know what trolling is and some of your posts fit it perfectly.
Still I don't say you are one, I'm not sure yet and don't want to be unfriendly.
tux9th ban request, regardless of if I find it right or wrong, was definitely no trolling.
You seem to not know what trolling really means, so if you want to understand, you should look it up.

Len asked me a question, so I answered it. You seem to think that sentence I bolded means something completely different than how I understood it, so please be specific and explain what you think it really means.

You misunderstood Frosty's post.
And sorry, but please understand that I'm too tired of this stuff to explain it.
Just look at his post more carefully.

[Len]

I really doubt that if it was a threat that it was directed at me, and even in the off chance that it was I don't care. As I don't really play the game often, I also don't have any information on the forums that I care to keep (I got nothing to lose). So please don't include me in any persecution rants.

[blackrazor]

I know what trolling is and some of your posts fit it perfectly.
Still I don't say you are one, I'm not sure yet and don't want to be unfriendly.
tux9th ban request, regardless of if I find it right or wrong, was definitely no trolling.
You seem to not know what trolling really means, so if you want to understand, you should look it up.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet)

"In Internet slang, a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion."

tux9th's request is inflammatory, off-topic (not really an appropriate topic for a player to start about another player ... there are more appropriate channels for that sort of thing), certainly has the potential to start arguments or upset people, can provoke readers into an emotional response, etc. It certainly looks like it fits the definition to me.

The posts I have made that were controversial certainly, were in a thread created and sanctioned by the TMWC and Crush, at least as soon as such a thread receptacle was provided for them. I have placed them in the appropriate "The official server move flamewar topic", where if you read the title before entering, it is clear what you will find therein.

The only time I posted anything controversial elsewhere (recently), was this poll, where I claim an admin went too far in suggesting to delete me (disguised as a helpful service), and to ask the community if they support these kinds of actions, not only for me, but for anyone else who may one day find themselves in a similar position. Granted, it's inflammatory, but I think we have a right to defend ourselves, too.

Len asked me a question, so I answered it. You seem to think that sentence I bolded means something completely different than how I understood it, so please be specific and explain what you think it really means.

You misunderstood Frosty's post.
And sorry, but please understand that I'm too tired of this stuff to explain it.
Just look at his post more carefully.

Your response is more of a riddle than an explanation. If you are going to make a claim, then you should at least explain it. If you are too tired of this stuff to explain your point, then perhaps you should wait to make your point for when you can provide an accompanying explanation. It's not fair to make a counter-claim, but then to just say you are too tired of this stuff to explain your point of view. I am genuinely interested in your point of view, but I cannot read your mind to get at it, sorry. I tried reading his post more carefully, as per your advice, but I did not see any other meaning to it that you have presumably found. So I remain curious.

[Cassy]

"In Internet slang, a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion."

Just like I said before:
I know what trolling is and some of your posts fit it perfectly.

tux9th's request is totally legal, reasonable, therefore not inflammatory and not off-topic (we have an abuse section here as you surely know) just because of above mentioned trolling.
Sorry, but it is your own problem if you just don't understand or want to understand.

Your response is more of a riddle than an explanation. If you are going to make a claim, then you should at least explain it.

Always look at yourself before pointing at others - this is a general guideline you should consider before posting.
You expect that I explain something to you, that you got wrong, others already explained and you didn't understand.
Sorry, the fault for this confusion is cleary is on your side, so work on yourself first before poiting at others.

[blackrazor]

"In Internet slang, a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion."

Just like I said before:
I know what trolling is and some of your posts fit it perfectly.

tux9th's request is totally legal, reasonable, therefore not inflammatory and not off-topic (we have an abuse section here as you surely know) just because of above mentioned trolling.
Sorry, but it is your own problem if you just don't understand or want to understand.

Your response is more of a riddle than an explanation. If you are going to make a claim, then you should at least explain it.

Always look at yourself before pointing at others - this is a general guideline you should consider before posting.
You expect that I explain something to you, that you got wrong, others already explained and you didn't understand.
Sorry, the fault for this confusion is cleary is on your side, so work on yourself first before poiting at others.

Sorry, but your opaque response says more about you than it does about me. I get that the community is angry now, and like villagers with their pitchforks, they have found their quasimodo. Maybe you should take some of your own advice. If I posted what tux9th posted, I would be accused of trolling or worse. If I made a counter-claim without backing it up, I would be called on it. You seem to think that one set of rules apply for those people you like or agree with, and another set of rules apply for those you don't like or agree with. It's a mob mentality and I don't think it's fair, and I'm calling you on it. Without any hate or vitriol.

[Cassy]

Btw your signature combined with your quote that you are on no side is one of reasons why people think you are a troll:
http://forums.themanaworld.org/viewtopi ... 77#p135377

And it's totally unimportant on which side you are, it's just about your lie.

[blackrazor]

Btw your signature combined with your quote that you are on no side is one of reasons why people think you are a troll:
http://forums.themanaworld.org/viewtopi ... 77#p135377

And it's totally unimportant on which side you are, it's just about your lie.

For someone who is too tired to explain any of it, you just go on and on with the accusations.

I was asked about that in the thread you mentioned, and I gave an answer there, too. I have been harsh about some of the actions from both sides, but this is not the proper thread to discuss that, so bring it up there, not here. If you do it here, it is trolling, if you do it there, it is on topic.

[Cassy]

Sorry, but your opaque response says more about you than it does about me. I get that the community is angry now, and like villagers with their pitchforks, they have found their quasimodo. Maybe you should take some of your own advice.

What exactly are you referring to?
This has nothing to do with what I wrote.

If I posted what tux9th posted, I would be accused of trolling or worse.

No. He had a reason to post this (did you read what I wrote?).

You seem to think that one set of rules apply for those people you like or agree with, and another set of rules apply for those you don't like or agree with.

Sorry, what?
Please keep in mind that you are not talking to a child...
I'm really trying to find something I can reply to this, but I can't say anything except "nonesense" and "please read my posts again" :-/


This whole post of me is not satisfactory for me, but I believe this is just because we are running in circles.
I'm more and more about to believe the others that you are a troll

Edit:

For someone who is too tired to explain any of it, you just go on and on with the accusations.

I was asked about that in the thread you mentioned, and I gave an answer there, too. I have been harsh about some of the actions from both sides, but this is not the proper thread to discuss that, so bring it up there, not here. If you do it here, it is trolling, if you do it there, it is on topic.

Sorry, but..........

[Crush]

Cassy and blackrazor, please stop the argument about who is trolling who. Such discussions never lead anywhere.

Rule number one when dealing with trolls is to not feed them. So when you truly believe that the person you talk to is trolling, just do not reply.

[Nard]

I recognize that my post will be seen a bit trolling but It seems necessary to me to post it to make you realize that you are a bit across the border here.
@madcamel, freeyorp, jaxad, o11c....

After your posts I think you have no more objection if I publish Argul's online list data here? and if I make some stats with them?


cf Argul's post in Mrgrey's poll