Stupid rules

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DefinitelyNOTMrWho
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Stupid rules

Post by DefinitelyNOTMrWho »

I'm sick and tired of GMs bending the game rules and using all kinds of idiotic ways to interpret them. These are the ONLY written rules i know of:

1. Do not abuse other players (insults, swearing, and the like directed to a particular person or persons);
2. No bots (including ANY AFK activity or automated following);
3. No spamming / flooding (including trade spam);
4. No begging;
5. Speak English on public chat;
6. Treat others the same way you would like to be treated;

Let me tell you what happened: I was killing yetis using 2 of my accounts. I used a warrior as bait and then stepped in with the mage to pound their ass. While doing this I also hit the yetis with my warrior so I get double the amount of XP. I play the game in windowed mode and set a small resolution so I can skip from one window to another as needed.
While doing this, one of the 50 GMs (we have 1 GM/ 2players) shows up and tells me I am "bending" the rules and I should stop.

I was wondering what the hell is this guy talking about, I wasn't insulting nobody, I wasn't begging, wasn't botting, wasn't speaking romanian in public and for damn sure wasn't spamming.

So can anyone from TMWC or GMs please explain how was I breaking the rules and if I was please change the official rules so they become CLEAR and leave no room for interpretation.
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o11c
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by o11c »

By definition, if you switch away from one window while it is in combat, it is AFK activity.

The keyboard can only be attached to one client at a time.

(Yes, there is a theoretical exploit using two keyboards. But that won't be taken as a valid excuse.)
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Chay
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by Chay »

@o11c: the keyboard can't, a gamepad can. and it's not to hard to do that with the keyboard too... also hit x once with a tanked but veeeery weak warrior on a (tank trapped) Poltergeist -> make coffee and watch youtube instead of your char has been tolerated to now and is afk activity by your definition too -> what comes to my mind: solution a) castrate client | solution b) disallow multiboxing out of towns...
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DefinitelyNOTMrWho
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by DefinitelyNOTMrWho »

o11c wrote:By definition, if you switch away from one window while it is in combat, it is AFK activity.

The keyboard can only be attached to one client at a time.

(Yes, there is a theoretical exploit using two keyboards. But that won't be taken as a valid excuse.)
That's a dumb explanation for a dumb interpretation of a rule. What about I say i'm not "multiboxing", is the GM gonna ask me to move with both chars at the same time in circles and say "Round and round give my ass a pound"? How do you know it's not 2 persons playing from the same ip.

I like that you people are trying to enforce the rules but this is overkill.

If he thinks I am doing AFK activity he can botcheck me and I will answer because I am not AFK.
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prsm
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by prsm »

For the record I was the GM.

If you do not like the rule, try and get it changed. Until the rule is changed you were in violation of the botting rule and were asked (in private) to please stop.
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DefinitelyNOTMrWho
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by DefinitelyNOTMrWho »

I didn't want to embarrass you Prsm, that's why I didn't say who it was.

And for the record there is no such rule.

There is a rule about AFK activity (AWAY FROM KEYBOARD).

I'm pretty sure everyone knows what away from keyboard means.
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prsm
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by prsm »

Perhaps read what o11c said!
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DefinitelyNOTMrWho
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by DefinitelyNOTMrWho »

prsm wrote:Perhaps read what o11c said!
o11c is good at coding or whatever he does but I don't think he is the one person in charge of rules here. These rules were made by the community for the community. It's not o11c's game. If he isn't capable of seeing something that doesn't mean that thing doesn't exist.

I want every member of the TMWC to post his point of view in this matter. If they all agree that playing in 2 windows is illegal then I want the rules changed to specify this thing.

I understand banning AFK activity but I was actually playing. 2 clients makes the game more demanding because you have to watch out for both of them and also you get more XP.
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by prsm »

Your questions have been answered, thank you for shopping at Kmart.
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Big Crunch
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by Big Crunch »

Its against the rules to be playing 2 characters simultaneously. It is automation, which is against the rules. If its not automated, GMs will give you the opportunity to prove otherwise. It is a simple test.
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Chay
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by Chay »

i will repeat myself here even though i actually think that is bad style:

1. you can have two characters attacking things at the same time because all it takes is pressing 'x' once and be a warrior so press x in 2 + x clients. This is what ablu repeatedly points out. How is player supposed to prove that he does that?

2. you can have 2 characters walk in different directions at the same time if you have a game pad. I demonstrated this several times to prove a point: Take a gamepad and a keyboard and control one character with the gamepad and one with the keyboard. Interesting coordination challenges appear as well. This can be extended to more input devices if someone is tech-versatile enough and a good juggler.

3. a logical and simple solution to get rid of debates like the present one is a rule that disallows multiple characters of one person on the same place logged on unless it is parked in a sit spot in town... (there might be some problems with the pink flowers spot though... oh well xp-ing in town should not be possible anyway so if that rule change is actually taken into account i promise to commit a mapfix ) In addition that also solves some complications for the rather complicated task of carefully designing multiplayer events and per-map rewards.
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Hello=)
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by Hello=) »

o11c wrote:The keyboard can only be attached to one client at a time.
Interestingly, I recently met some "mad skillz" player who is able to play 2 chars at once, using... 2 different keyboards attached to 2 different computers, running 2 different clients. Since humans have 2 hands, its technically possible to be "at keyboard" on 2 keyboards. And while it's multiboxing for sure, both clients are not AFK. Yes, sometimes humans can be amazing. Especially when it comes to making their life more convenient or taking advantage over others.
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veryape
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by veryape »

Well, if someone has those mad skills they will have no problems passing the simultanious movement tests, i don't really see the problem.

Just the same as happens when a gm see two players from the same ip that is playing on one map. Prove that they are able to move both at once following different directions from the gm.

The solution of only one player per ip active is quite harsh since we have families playing etc.
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Reid
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by Reid »

Why not make a clear rule about multitasking with different client? I though that it was made some years ago.
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Re: Stupid rules

Post by Speiros02 »

I don't bot. In fact I've never botted. I have in times experimented with having the x button held down, but never was I away from keyboard...never (sure sounds like a 'clean' version of Bill Clinton or something, but it's exactly how it is) :lol: . I'm serious. I've been at the keyboard all the time while I've been active on this game. It's not a brownie point statement, but a statement made for the angle of no-one can accuse me of botting.

The rule for having two accounts open at the same time though would be an annoying inconvenience, in that I use some of my clients as storage, which means that I'd have to use a third-party person to "hold" my stuff while I go from one character to the next to get stuff out of storage which I use as a secondary character, I would have to rely on a secondary person. I don't think that's fair, in that it means that if I was a total loner, I couldn't do this on game. Also, it doesn't prevent OTHER people from being able to change their IP's and MAC addy's by the lovely programs that make it easier for people to do these things, except target those who are doing things the honest and hard way.

I do think that having two players attacking the same mob (owned by the same person, and played by them simultaneously) is an issue that was addressed earlier, and think that some of the angles of correction have been tangental in a sense. Still, I understand the idea of having two "windows" open at the same time as being a separate issue to afk activity.

The away-from-keyboard rule needs a different definition to be clear. The botting was clarified, yet even then, there is the technicality of having two minutes to answer (it appears).

Can I propose (if there isn't one already) that there be a list of definitions for the game? I noticed on the CRC site there is a good list of what certain in-game terminology means, which is a helpful and necessary list. We should also have one here, along with a "disclaimer" as such, in that the people who continue to play will accept the rules on the basis that they can be updated and edited...at the same time having an organised and approved way of updating and editing. The definitions I'm talking about are what the in-game meaning of the word 'botting' means for example, for the Macquarie or Oxford dictionary might differ. This would be helpful in not only establishing the rules, but having something to work from to make things clearer.
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