CONCENTRATION THREAD - Tulimshar, phase 1

Post by **Rotonen** » 30 Jun 2005, 16:29

All conceptual artists, please read this through: http://themanaworld.org/wiki/index.php/Tulimshar

I'm now officially starting the concentrated phase 1 of conceptual development on our first kingdom. This means that everyone should concentrate on inputting their vision of this kingdom here and we'll discuss over your visions to find some sort of compromise to lock down and then we'll start phase 2: intense pixellation. (This also includes storyline discussion.)

Pieces I'd like to see relatively soon:

- An overview of the city (something between a map and an architectual plan).
- An overview of the region (maps conceptualized).
- Detailed illustrations of important places (both inside and outside the city).
- Illustrations of the people, especially their clothing and equipment. Day to day accessories.

Please feel free to add content if you feel we're lacking it and we'll discuss the idea here.

Post by **Rotonen** » 01 Jul 2005, 14:26

Some referrences to go with, only for referrence, don't want to see carbon copies of these:

For the nature:
http://www.mikelevin.com/DeathValleyCac ... ape800.jpg
http://cs.anu.edu.au/~James.Popple/phot ... -1999b.jpg
http://www.gamehaus.net/albums/2005deat ... G_2033.jpg
http://thinks.com/jigsaw/landscapes/dea ... fornia.jpg
http://www.tiwy.com/pais/chile/atacama/1.jpg
http://www.americas-fr.com/geographie/p ... tacama.jpg
http://www.raphaelk.co.uk/web%20pics/Ch ... %20air.JPG
http://www.intraisass.it/foto%2012%20de ... TACAMA.jpg
http://www.news.cornell.edu/photos/atac ... und300.jpg
http://www.cs.technion.ac.il/~itaish/Ch ... eLuna3.jpg
http://www.danheller.com/images/Africa/ ... hara-i.jpg
http://www.geographicguide.com/travel/sahara.jpg
http://www.wildcamels.com/Images/trek/G ... 20Gobi.jpg
http://www.meridianphotographicgallery. ... 0Dunes.jpg
http://www.jaxpro.net/~cbishop/MO68%20- ... illage.jpg
http://www.thebeijingcenter.org/expedit ... Desert.jpg
http://www.fsao.kais.kyoto-u.ac.jp/copm_agri/sahel.JPG
http://www.oxfam.org.uk/coolplanet/wate ... _sahel.jpg
http://www.viaggiatorionline.com/partne ... 0sahel.jpg

The idea would be that towards the edges of the desert it would transform into a savannah and then little by little into a forrest.

For the city:
http://www.skianmhor.co.uk/images/Sundr ... 20View.jpg
http://www.scuolelivigno.it/inquinamento/sahel.JPG
http://www.pyreneesquarries.com.au/gall ... ll_640.jpg
http://www.gosfordquarries.com.au/image ... neWall.jpg
http://www.scpusa.com/assets/images/Sta ... dstone.gif
http://www.bourgetbros.com/flagstone/im ... dstone.jpg
http://www.indian-sandstone.com/gifs/sa ... -walls.jpg
http://www.winefoodacademy.com/Images/i ... ilding.jpg
http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/msnbc/Compo ... medium.jpg
http://www.mizyana.com/Album/Ksa%20Hadada.jpg

Remember, the city is a fortress.

This post can be edited at any time without any further notice from me...

neoriceisgood · Post by **neoriceisgood** » 01 Jul 2005, 20:23

Nice photographs.

Post by **Modanung** » 13 Jul 2005, 21:56

A quick colour concept sketch of the wall of Tulimshar with a tower and some banners:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y203/M ... mshar3.jpg

Post by **ElvenProgrammer** » 21 Jul 2005, 14:16

I think we could start using the conceptualization made by Modanung:

I subdivided it into areas. Each one will be a different map.

1) Light blue: area of the royal palace. From there it should be possible to go to royal tombs to the north outside city walls. Need a conceptualization of the palace, silo and mill.

2) Blue: center of town. We already have some concept art about maret and buildings (even if an idea of their displacement could be cool). Need concept art for pet shop and inn as well as some views of the dried up river.

3) Green: need to be defined better, but I guess it will be an area for farms on somewhat rocky/sand mountains. Need zoomed in concept art.

4) Red: just outside the city walls, a camp of nomads. Need concept art of tents, most of all and some details for the landscape.

5) Yellow: west of the city. We could use a plain desert map there, just as the one we have now south of tulimshar.

Now I'm working on a remapping of the tonori desert kingdom according to the new concept of tulimshar and the old kiokay's ideas.
If everyone agrees with this ideas we could go deeper into the conceptualization/description of maps and we will assign tasks to every available concept artist.
I'd like to help in this task as well but i'm busy, i'm not talented, i don't have a scanner and i'm a programmer not an artist. Anyway I want to see this project growing and it seems world development slowed down a bit so I'll do what I can.

Please post your comments.

Post by **ElvenProgrammer** » 21 Jul 2005, 14:47

Those are the most important maps of Tonori kingdom:

Probably we will need more plain desert maps around the fire palace and oasi as well.
And we could split the center of city map in 2 parts, or we could add another map for the hill. Once this region is complete we could start working on others.

Post by **Pajarico** » 24 Jul 2005, 00:16

I like most of it.

Sorry but what is the "Fire Palace"? I never heard of it.

4) Red: just outside the city walls, a camp of nomads. Need concept art of tents, most of all and some details for the landscape.

What are "the nomads"? merchants, travellers, people who season the crops (temporary workers)?

Post by **Pajarico** » 24 Jul 2005, 03:38

I'm working on the palace right now. Tomorrow I will have something.

Post by **ElvenProgrammer** » 24 Jul 2005, 08:00

Well I mean fire temple, maybe I'm using too manaish language. Anyway I see the temple was placed by Kyokai on a island near the desert of glass. I think placing it deeper in the desert would fit more. But again I could be influenced by old memories.

Post by **Modanung** » 24 Jul 2005, 19:20

That drawing wasn't finnished yet... but that doesn't matter.

I think what you defined as area 1 could use something like a barracks with royal armory. I thought of it as a place of the city which is well defendable in times of war. It is designed in a way that when the rest of the city is taken over the 'important' people of the city can survive

The squares in the river bank are residences of the lowest and poorest part of the people, who can't afford a house. They put up a simple place to live in the dried up river.

The nomads are travellers of all sorts... with tents. They don't need an expensive bed in a tavern because they are used to sleeping out in the desert. Among these nomads are mercenaries and bounty hunters, simple merchants... actually all the people who stay longer then a day but don't sleep inside the city.

I thought of area 2 as a bit ritcher houses but mainly the economic centre of the city; the market, some shops, and the inn.

What ElvenProgrammer marked as green was meant as a residencial area and agriculture on the hill. This is where most average people live. Maybe there should be a pub, with some illegal trading. And on the vertile hill there should be just farms.

I also thought that somewhere at at least one of the gates we'd need a census and exice office with a small prison (for petty criminals). The large prison would be beneath the palace.

Post by **Pajarico** » 25 Jul 2005, 01:40

http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/817/ ... 0055ud.png

The palace.

Misses the top part because I haven't done it yet. Probably a top like medieval castles, unless you have a better suggestion

PS: This reminds me that we should create a flag, and other cultural symbols.

Post by **Modanung** » 25 Jul 2005, 13:10

Pajarico, very nice drawing... but I think either the entrance is too small or the steps are huge.

And I think it's a bit simple... it could use some side structures/rooms.
Or is this just the entrance and is the rest of the palace inside the mountains?

As for the top part: Maybe a mosque-like tower would be appropriate.
(Aswan mosque)

Which reminds me of the religious part of culture... are we going to have religions in the game? One or several? (Probably some cults too)
If we would I suppose most of them would involve mana. Some could involve god(s) (like Christianity), some could involve natures powers (like the Native-American religion), some could maybe involve aliens/never-seen-creatures and some could have a more scientific view on the world.

And Pajarico's note on the flags/symbols reminded me I never posted my concept on the forums.
-A piece of Tulimshars walls
-An unfinnished 3D model of Tulimshar.

Although I think that banner isn't good enough.

Post by **Pajarico** » 25 Jul 2005, 15:41

Pajarico, very nice drawing... but I think either the entrance is too small or the steps are huge. Razz

Thank you.
The steps are too huge. The scale of the drawing wasn't very big so I didn't want to detail everything too much, I was afraid of overloading it and look to confuse. The same goes to the terrace, the floor should be tiled with beautiful flagstones, that should represent some important figures, legends or events of the history of the city.

Actually, the height of one of the steps on the drawing should be the height of a person. That's pretty big for a building.

And I think it's a bit simple... it could use some side structures/rooms.

Be more precise, please.
More elements on the facade, like windows, ornamentation, paintings, sculptures, columns...)?
Or more like a church or a cathedral, with its different wings (different instances or rooms)?

If you meant the first, i didn't detail it because i prefer to do the ornamental part aside.

Or is this just the entrance and is the rest of the palace inside the mountains?

Hrad to tell. It could be both, but I prefer to leave the design somewhat open since I don't know at this point how many rooms we need and for what purpose are needed (in terms of space)...

BTW, if the inhabitants are really goods spirit and look for the well-being of people, they should have a humble palace rather than a magnificient one.

On the 3d map: The part at right its sinked on the sand. Did that on purpose or not? It seems like a weak point for defense.

On the banner: It needs more work. Rather than a representation of the mana, i prefer to put some other important symbol of Tulimshar, they are a kingdom of warriors mainly, so something related to weapons.
Something like this:
http://images.google.es/images?q=%22esc ... a=N&tab=wi

Post by **Modanung** » 26 Jul 2005, 13:34

Pajarico wrote:The same goes to the terrace, the floor should be tiled with beautiful flagstones, that should represent some important figures, legends or events of the history of the city.

The floor of the terrace? shouldn't that be done on some walls or on a floor where more people pass by. At least I suppose the terrace isn't for ordinairy people.

Pajarico wrote:Or more like a church or a cathedral, with its different wings (different instances or rooms)?

Yes, with side structure I meant something like wings. Just a more complex floorplan then a circle.

Or is this just the entrance and is the rest of the palace inside the mountains?

Hrad to tell. It could be both, but I prefer to leave the design somewhat open since I don't know at this point how many rooms we need and for what purpose are needed (in terms of space)...

Pajarico wrote:BTW, if the inhabitants are really goods spirit and look for the well-being of people, they should have a humble palace rather than a magnificient one.

I thought about that one... and I suppose it makes sence

Pajarico wrote:On the 3d map: The part at right its sinked on the sand. Did that on purpose or not? It seems like a weak point for defense.

I suppose you mean the hill? That is where all the farming takes place. The hill is surrounded by guardtowers.
But maybe you're right and should the hill be on the outside of the walls.

Pajarico wrote:On the banner: It needs more work.

Yes, I meant "isn't" instead of "is", corrected it now. So I agree.
And yes, it should probably show some weapons.

Post by **Pajarico** » 29 Jul 2005, 00:40

The floor of the terrace? shouldn't that be done on some walls or on a floor where more people pass by. At least I suppose the terrace isn't for ordinairy people.

Everyone who enters in it has to be a important figure, a guest, servants, warriors, or the player in a quest or doing a errand.
So yes, the entire palace is not for ordinary people.

I didn't think of the walls but, the terrace has to be tiled with some important scene of the city history.

Yes, with side structure I meant something like wings. Just a more complex floorplan then a circle.

Ok

I'm currently working on a new version with two buildings (one inside the mountain, the other outside). Will post a update soon.

Have you worked on the flag?