Mush Hat and Shroom Hat and Eggshell Hat

[blackrazor]

All three of these hats are such cute looking hats, and they are already in the game's database, just no longer obtainable from loots or quests.

It would be cool if they dropped, even rarely (similar to 4-leaf clover drop rate), from monsters themed similarly to the hats.

The mush hat could drop from evil mushrooms at 0.05 % chance
The shroom hat could drop from spikey mushrooms at 0.05% chance
The eggshell hat could drop from grass snakes at 0.05% chance

With Infantry and Candle hats being so easily available, I doubt these hats would cause imbalance if re-introduced, and they would add to the fun fashion atmosphere that is already such a nice part of TMW.

[tux9th]

Those items are collectables and will never be re-introduced.
That's the vibe I got from the rest of the Community.

I don't think you will be able to change that even though I would really like those hats back as event gifts or stuff like that. Maybe if the last one of those hats vanished and they're are all gone it will get back.

greets

[Crush]

Maybe you could reintroduce them as new items with a slightly different color. The old collectible version would then still be unique.

[Nami]

I'm pretty sure they used to be drops from the so called monsters as blackrazor said except from the eggshell...maybe that was from an event. The mouboo also dropped the Moubootaur Head iirc. When the monsters stopped dropping them, they became rare EVIL MONSTERS!!!

But it would be cool like Crush said to have them in different colours...I bagsy the green one!

/\/

[Reid]

Those items are collectables and will never be re-introduced.
That's the vibe I got from the rest of the Community.

As far as I know, the wish of the old content lead (Wombat) was to re-introduce them from time to time during some seasonal event to break the "collectible" effect and to permit to for new player to obtain these hats.

I don't know what Jenalya thinks about that, though, but it's sad if the development is back to this "rare item" trip.

[Jenalya]

Those items are collectables and will never be re-introduced.
That's the vibe I got from the rest of the Community.

As far as I know, the wish of the old content lead (Wombat) was to re-introduce them from time to time during some seasonal event to break the "collectible" effect and to permit to for new player to obtain these hats.

I don't know what Jenalya thinks about that, though, but it's sad if the development is back to this "rare item" trip.

Some rares were re-introduced in Christmas 2010 and Easter 2011 (Mush Hat and Shroom Hat in both). After Easter 2011 many collectors were upset, because their collection lost quite some of its value due to the number of old rares getting into the game again.
I said I'll avoid re-introducing old event rewards if possible, to respect that collecting is a main aspect of the game for some players. I think it'd be reasonable to bring back some old items after a few years, but for e.g. the Mush and the Shroom Hat it's too early after the last occasions they were available.

[blackrazor]

I agree with Jenalya that collecting, especially of hats, is an important part of TMW for some players, just as it is for Ragnarok Online.

However, I have a hard time sympathizing with those collectors who insist on having a rare item; rare because it is removed from loot tables and no longer offered at seasonal events. In my opinion, that is collecting at the expense of others, since new players cannot expect to obtain such things for their own collections. I had hoped that collecting was for the joy of showing off some nice pixels and adding it to your social hat wardrobe, and not the merchanting aspect of maintaining value on something that was originally looted for free and then often sold at high prices later.

I was a long ago player of Runescape, and I remember well the Party Hats and Santas. I was there when these things originally dropped, and I always refused to merchant these holiday items, because the Gowers asked us not to, as it destroyed the holiday spirit in which they were given. Eventually Runescape grew and profited and changed into something unrecognizable from its original form, and merchanting of rares became became accepted and even encouraged, but I never bought into it, as it seemed the game was moving in a greedy commercial direction, and I still agreed with the initial feelings of the original creative leads. I remember wishing that the original and subsequent holiday rares be offered in a way that new players could enjoy them also, and I did not care what that would do to the value of the few I had owned and kept for personal wardrobe use.

I apologize if this is too strongly worded, no flames or disrespect are intended. I suppose I have some strong feelings on commercialization and merchanting in general, which is what lead me to a truly free game in the first place. Not because I am too stingy to pay (I have paid for games before and thoroughly enjoyed those experiences), but because in recent years "freemium" models have effected the way new games are designed from the ground up, providing entry hooks for cash-shop items at all junctures at the expense of an actual enjoyable playable experience.

But I digress, and this was already too long.

Cheers,

-Selenil

[Chicka-Maria]

the rare hat shroom hat was worth about 8 million gp before it was rereleased. now its only worth about 1-2 million gp. I dont think its a problem letting go of super rares that have been out for about 5 years like in the past due to collectors because collectors do spend most of their time with marketing rather then leveling and questing. Collecting is a huge part of tmw. Best for people to earn the hats and look for them and enjoy the excitement of finding one and buying one rather than complaining theres no quest for it. This has been discussed several times and it would be awkward to see another thread on the same thing once again.

Regards,

[blackrazor]

the rare hat shroom hat was worth about 8 million gp before it was rereleased. now its only worth about 1-2 million gp. I dont think its a problem letting go of super rares that have been out for about 5 years like in the past due to collectors because collectors do spend most of their time with marketing rather then leveling and questing.

Certainly players should be free to spend their time as they please. But those choices should not be used as a reason to limit what other players can reasonably accomplish in the game. The arbitrary value of in-game items, based on whether they are soon to be re-released or not, sounds a bit like gambling or speculation to me. And some people will likely know before others when this re-release is likely to take place. 5 years is an eternity in game time.

Collecting is a huge part of tmw.

I agree. But there is more than one way to collect. I prefer to collect in a way that does not limit the choices of others to do the same thing. Rares, by their very definition, cannot be collected in this way. Every rare that I would accumulate would be one less rare that someone else could obtain, as the supply is fixed and finite over large spans of time. Even steadily on the decrease, if you factor in inactive and purged accounts.

Best for people to earn the hats and look for them and enjoy the excitement of finding one and buying one rather than complaining theres no quest for it.

But here's the problem with that. I don't want to use my gold to obtain something that then takes away from someone else's ability to do the same thing. I am totally fine with things that are seasonal, available perhaps for only a few specific days in a calendar year. But if it gets to be more than that, then I just feel it would be unfair for me to have that item at the expense of others. It's a shame too, because they are some nice looking pixels, that similar to Fluffy Hats and Pinkie Hats, I feel were not originally meant to be locked up like this. Which is why I made the suggestion that I did about those specific items. (And not Top Hats, Paper Bags, Christmas Tree Hats, Rabbit Ears, Heart Glasses, Funky Hats, Christmas Elf Hats, etc.)

I am saddened by things within a game that limit players, based on reality outside of the game that they cannot control. Cash-shop items are one set of items that fall into this definition, as they depend on a player's wealth outside of the game. Rare items (in the context that we are referring to rares here: items deliberately discontinued to make them rare by that method) are another set of these items, as they depend on whether a player happened to be online some arbitrary number of years ago and maintained an active (non-purged) account throughout the intervening years.

In any case, I'm not complaining. I'm suggesting what I feel is an improvement. Some will agree with me, others will not. That is fine. I have given my reasoning in the interests of clarity. I totally respect that others might have differing points of view, and I do not seek to shut them down from expressing that.

This has been discussed several times and it would be awkward to see another thread on the same thing once again.

This forum has been around since at least 2004, and if we limit ourselves to things that have never been discussed, then that may leave us with precious few things left about which to chat. I was not active for the previous discussions on these matters, and I didn't realize that those previous discussions might limit my ability to talk about them now. So faced with the choice of necro-ing an old thread, or creating my own with my own ideas, I chose the later. I think that as long as you have players with different, but reasonable, points of view on a given topic, then you will continue to see constructive discussions.

[o11c]

FWIW, my vote is in opposition of rare items.

[Chicka-Maria]

FWIW, my vote is in opposition of rare items.

Which is what someone would say if they dont collect or have made a collection over the years.....lol

but anyways..

I understand some people don't enjoy looking and searching for items that are not in quests but you have to understand people spent hours of game play to accomplish the collections they have now, or weeks or months lol how fair would it be to them if they spent so much hard work to find something and spent their time making gp for it to just be released soon? It wouldn't be very fair at all to those players just because your to lazy to look for it...

The best thing to do instead of complaining there's no quest is to try and spend as much time as these players have and work for what you want and search, plus events wouldnt be very fun if it was the same item every year or same quest every year that would get boring. New items being brought for holiday events is a great way to make players look forward to the major events of the year after. What's the point of making events if the items are for a quest after besides getting them earlier? lol

Rares also keep the marketing going and allows the players to save up for something they really want, it would be ridiculous to just get something so easily.

Like i said in other threads that have brought this up, its a very bad idea to bring rares back because its not fair to those who have spent years or months or weeks of their time to try collecting these items ive also seen a few old players leave because old rares were brought back which we don't want.

I feel very strongly about this way of playing (collecting) and keeping it fair to those who have spent their time on it.

Think of it this way, you get to level 99 one day and then the next day theres a new quest that makes you from 70-99 (not that it will ever happen) but if it did how would you feel? lol

Regards,
Chicka

[o11c]

Which is what someone would say if they dont collect or have made a collection over the years.....lol

Which is most players, and especially most new players.

There's nothing wrong with annual quests, or with rewards that are reoffered every few years, because that rewards people who *stay* around, not people who have been here a long time.

[blackrazor]

FWIW, my vote is in opposition of rare items.

Which is what someone would say if they dont collect or have made a collection over the years.....lol

but anyways..

I understand some people don't enjoy looking and searching for items that are not in quests but you have to understand people spent hours of game play to accomplish the collections they have now, or weeks or months lol how fair would it be to them if they spent so much hard work to find something and spent their time making gp for it to just be released soon? It wouldn't be very fair at all to those players just because your to lazy to look for it...

The best thing to do instead of complaining there's no quest is to try and spend as much time as these players have and work for what you want and search, plus events wouldnt be very fun if it was the same item every year or same quest every year that would get boring. New items being brought for holiday events is a great way to make players look forward to the major events of the year after. What's the point of making events if the items are for a quest after besides getting them earlier? lol

Rares also keep the marketing going and allows the players to save up for something they really want, it would be ridiculous to just get something so easily.

Like i said in other threads that have brought this up, its a very bad idea to bring rares back because its not fair to those who have spent years or months or weeks of their time to try collecting these items ive also seen a few old players leave because old rares were brought back which we don't want.

I feel very strongly about this way of playing (collecting) and keeping it fair to those who have spent their time on it.

Think of it this way, you get to level 99 one day and then the next day theres a new quest that makes you from 70-99 (not that it will ever happen) but if it did how would you feel? lol

Regards,
Chicka

Nobody is complaining and nobody is being lazy. Some people just disagree that the current rares system is what is best for the game. For the record, if I grind at GY until 99, and the next day there is a quest to jump from 70 to 99 in one click, I will not care. I enjoyed the GY's hectic frenzied pace. And I already think that the grind is too long, and merely a hold-over from the Ragnarok design (which needed a long grind to support their subscription payment model and we inherited that along with the eAthena RO emulator). I would prefer less grind, and maybe a castle wars instead, for players to spend time on, or capture the flag, or bosses. GY for the fun of it is good too, so is Rescue Cindy and Candor. And everyone is different. I already told you my actual Runescape experience; I had all the rares there, but I still wished everyone could have their own and I did not care what that would do to the value of mine. I measure my own collecting by my own internal yardstick, and not what I have that others don't.

** EDIT: I added this paragraph and my 2nd edit was to note that I made that edit. I didn't realize there was already a response at the time **

In another of my feedback suggestions, http://forums.themanaworld.org/viewtopi ... =4&t=16213, I recommend dropping the materials required for the Love Triangle quest. I've already done the quest and obtained the reward, and I don't plan to do that particular quest again on any of my alts. If my suggestion is taken, it will make it easier for those that come after me to get the same rewards that I got with a bigger effort. Furthermore, it will reduce the value of my quest rewards, since they will be easier to obtain. But regardless, I would be happy if the changes went through, because I honestly feel it is better for the game. That I will potentially "lose out" from my own suggestion does not worry me in the slightest. It's just not how I approach games or life in general, sorry.

** EDIT ends here **

To be clear, this is not a hill I'm willing to die on. Whichever way this goes won't make or break the enjoyment of TMW for me. I'm already having fun, and I will still have fun, either way. This is the feedback section, and all I did was post my suggestions for the game (against my better judgement, by the way). I don't appreciate you twice now implying laziness and complaints in others where there is none. There is merely a difference of opinion. I can respect yours. Why can't you seem to respect mine?

[Chicka-Maria]

FWIW, my vote is in opposition of rare items.

Which is what someone would say if they dont collect or have made a collection over the years.....lol

but anyways..

I understand some people don't enjoy looking and searching for items that are not in quests but you have to understand people spent hours of game play to accomplish the collections they have now, or weeks or months lol how fair would it be to them if they spent so much hard work to find something and spent their time making gp for it to just be released soon? It wouldn't be very fair at all to those players just because your to lazy to look for it...

The best thing to do instead of complaining there's no quest is to try and spend as much time as these players have and work for what you want and search, plus events wouldnt be very fun if it was the same item every year or same quest every year that would get boring. New items being brought for holiday events is a great way to make players look forward to the major events of the year after. What's the point of making events if the items are for a quest after besides getting them earlier? lol

Rares also keep the marketing going and allows the players to save up for something they really want, it would be ridiculous to just get something so easily.

Like i said in other threads that have brought this up, its a very bad idea to bring rares back because its not fair to those who have spent years or months or weeks of their time to try collecting these items ive also seen a few old players leave because old rares were brought back which we don't want.

I feel very strongly about this way of playing (collecting) and keeping it fair to those who have spent their time on it.

Think of it this way, you get to level 99 one day and then the next day theres a new quest that makes you from 70-99 (not that it will ever happen) but if it did how would you feel? lol

Regards,
Chicka

Nobody is complaining and nobody is being lazy. Some people just disagree that the current rares system is what is best for the game. For the record, if I grind at GY until 99, and the next day there is a quest to jump from 70 to 99 in one click, I will not care. I enjoyed the GY's hectic frenzied pace. And I already think that the grind is too long, and merely a hold-over from the Ragnarok design (which needed a long grind to support their subscription payment model and we inherited that along with the eAthena RO emulator). I would prefer less grind, and maybe a castle wars instead, for players to spend time on, or capture the flag, or bosses. GY for the fun of it is good too, so is Rescue Cindy and Candor. And everyone is different. I already told you my actual Runescape experience; I had all the rares there, but I still wished everyone could have their own and I did not care what that would do to the value of mine. I measure my own collecting by my own internal yardstick, and not what I have that others don't.

To be clear, this is not a hill I'm willing to die on. Whichever way this goes won't make or break the enjoyment of TMW for me. I'm already having fun, and I will still have fun, either way. This is the feedback section, and all I did was post my suggestions for the game (against my better judgement, by the way). I don't appreciate you twice now implying laziness and complaints in others where there is none. There is merely a difference of opinion. I can respect yours. Why can't you seem to respect mine?

I respected it by replying back, its a forum you need to expect that people will show their other views on your thread. if you cant handle that well that's not very good then


Regards,

[o11c]

Ugh, minimize your quotes please.