New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Got something on your mind about the project? This is the correct place for that.


Forum rules

This forum is for feature requests, content changes additions, anything not a Bug in the software.
Please report all bugs on the Support Forums

User avatar
Ledmitz
TMW Classic
TMW Classic
Posts: 583
Joined: 17 Aug 2011, 22:40
Location: The Mana World
Contact:

New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by Ledmitz »

I've been thinking a bit about current spells in the game and new ones that could/should be added. I also took a look through some old RPG spell books for ideas and condensed the relevant ones into single spells, but first I thought dark magic itself could get looked at, since there re no apparent benefits to using it. Maybe that was intentional, IDK.

In other RPG's, if you actually have to choose a divination or type of magic, you get some bonuses for certain things or in the case of light vs dark magic, reversed spells are also possible. Usually Draker magic and war magic are thought to be dark, but not always, where healing/blessing, etc is light. Obviously war magic is already in use and should be usable by all players. Right now there is no asorm or summoning anything better than maggots for dark magic and as far as I know, that's the only difference, so I make reference to reversed spells below spells below. Dark magic is evil and damaging and should be more about offense than defense.

Dark mages need another summoned creature. I suggest bats, snakes, scorpions... anything thought of as inherently evil.

Reflect (dark) - The asorm for evil doers. It is not a shield, but an attack being sent back to the caster. I propose that this spell offers little to no actual protection per say, but that it has the possiblity to reflect some or all of the damage inflicted. Overall it should be the less guaranteed method of magic protection, but more vengeful in nature. whatever damage is not sent back, if any at all, will still effect the dark mage. An ingrav of 1000, might do 700hp to victim and 300hp to caster or totally vice versa.

Miteyo - This is detect magic, but currently only detects certain npc's. I'd love to have it show players with spells cast on them, as well. If you are betsanc'd, then a detect magic should see that clearly, even if you can't see that it is a betsanc. Detecting magic on a player could be very useful in certain situations.

Itenplz - Everyone loves this spell. It's a perfect example of how useful something so trivial can be. I heard it was made as a joke. One thing I'd like to see change, if possible is the ability to cancel the effects for your own spawns so that you don't need to run offscreen to have them attack mobs again. Maybe it could work more like a toggle on the friendlies, but this might be hard to implement.

Parum - Needs no explaination really. Just needs more figurines. Of course having a purpose for these things might be good, like needing them for a quest or something. I guess if you are interesting in starting to make sprites, this might be a good place to start. It requires only one picture, I assume.

Chiza - should automatically give the caster a plus on dex so they can actually hit mobs with it. The component is also not stackable. Maybe a stackable item could make this spell useful.

Upmarmu - ditto. Needs a dex bonus.

Joyplim - I know this spell is just for fun atm, but since it can be mischeivious, why not other plims? I thought it might be neat to simply change it so a joyplim would be a 3plim, devil face: 5plim, sick face: 1plim. The first number simply represent the corresponding alt shortcut. Would this be hard to do? Also, it would be quite funny to make NPC's and mobs smile too. It could even be used in a quest to help someone feeling down?

Skrimp - No use in the game, that I know of. It would be great if we could make potions or do other random things with it. I thought turning water into beer might be nice for a mage. or merging Iron and Conentration potions into one. I'm sure there's a use, but I haven't found it yet.

Haste - This is already a spell, but has been commented out. I've always wondered why. It should be like a concentration potion and be done with 2 or less pedals and can only be cast on another

IronFist - The iron potion spell. Used like Haste.

DispellMagic - One of the great things about being a mage is that you can undo your own blunders of magic cast by another. Obviously though, some magic in the game, should be permanent. This could undo betsancs, ingrav and other player cast spells if a succesul roll was made. It could also be used to make quests more interesting and puzzling.

Drain(dark) - Rather than dark mages using Inma, they could get a Drain spell. It is more selfish and overall, less useful for exp, but could help one heal themselves from stealing life energy from others. I suggest that the amount gained is a fraction of the amount drained. Overuse could lead to negative consequences for the caster, as well.

Cure(light)/Poison(dark) - Light magic would gain the ability the cure poisoned players, while Dark magic would cause living mobs only to be possibly poisoned, so long as they are not resistant based on their stats.

Aid(light)/Hinder(Dark) - Adds or takes away from anothers stats. Adding accuracy or taking it away. This could also affect magic attack and defense. Cast on target only.

TurnUndead/Fear - This is a "Behold my Power" type spell. Think of it as a priest holding up a symbol to ward off the undead creatures or evoke fear in the living. This would cause normally aggressive mobs to disregard you, or Assisting mobs to not assist. It could repel mobs at higher levels away from the caster. The higher you are in magic attack, the more targets you can affect and the effects can increase with magic attack as well. In other RPG's Turning an undead or causing fear from a high level caster can inanimate the undead completely, or kill the living(Dark mages can usually control undead, but I'll cover that in another spell. I suggest damage instead. This should not require you to use a component unless it is something you carry in your inventory. The taxing should be on the MP and if any item is required, it could be a magical or holy symbol, like a cross, pentagram, or something like these, but original to TMW.

MakeScroll - It doesn't have to be a scroll, but a usable item that a mage can prepare and give to another player. After it's use, it would disintegrate or burn up. Any class could use a scroll, but the magic in it should have less power than that of the caster. You could limit them to certain spells for simplicity, but any protective and war spells should be able to be made. A player charged with a scroll would also be detectable with miteyo as explained above.

PlayDead - I had 3 spells I condesed into 1 here. One was a portal to a safe place on the astral plane, another was to ward off all harm and magic, but playing dead seems more TMW style, so I went with that and it requires less work. Think of this as a pause button. Playing dead would cause a player to use the dead player animation, but still be alive(like @hide). Any movement, spellcasting, attacking, trading or any action other than talking and emotes(maybe not even allow this), would result in breaking the spell. This could be used for sabotage, to ward off players casting betsancs and joyplims on you as they would get a message stating there is no need to cast on the dead or something. All mobs would ignore you.

Illusion - This one is simple... The mage casts the spell and it looks as though he/she has droped an item. The item that appears is random. It could be anything in the game. When a player goes to pick it up, they get a message saying that it has vanished before their eyes. This could be used to annoy those pesky drop stealers, cause havock and confusion during a drop party, and even entice mobs that loot to be interested. This should never be able to enter a trade window for obvious reasons and should require little to no components.

Invisibility/Become shadow - I hm'd and haw'd over how to do this one. It would be nice if a mage could walk through mobs without them noticing them...A good way to get to the Cindy cave. Attacking and casting spells should reveal you. As for how players would perceive them, IDK what is right. Be invisible to everyone except GM's? Only show your name but not you? become a sillouette/shadow? At any rate.. something like this would be a nice addition but it's effects should be very temporary.

Alarm - This would be an invisible object preferably, but could still be detected as magic. It does no more than send a message to the caster when a player or mob comes within it's working radius.

Message - This could accomodate an alarm spell nicely. As a player goes within it's working radius a message is sent to general. This area is occupied. It would be great if you can leave custom messages. Not sure if this is possible. Tresspassers will be zapped on sight!!!

Warp - I know this is in the works. I hope it is limited in it's ability somehow. Limit to the current continent?

MinorTeleport - ok.. this one is neat. Whatever direction the player is facing in is the direction of travel they will teleport to. They can only do so on the screen and it's distance should be random, but the maximum distance should be based on M. attack. Useful for moving faster, getting out of danger zones or even into them. It would give the mage a little edge on moving faster, which is why it should be hard on the magic meter.

Stun - Should affect attributes temporarily. Int and luck for sure... Agility and Dexterity too? All attributes? Like a knock in the noggin without the damage.

Fireball - Another spell that has already been made. I propose that it can affect certain items, like logs and roots or other flammable things. You could setup some neat traps and fire barriers with it. Handling this outside of PVP could be tough, unless you had it not affect players unless in PVP. Is it possible to code an item on the ground to hurt others?

Seekers - This is multiple projectiles being hurdled simultaneously. If there is only one target, it takes all damage. 2 or more targets; damage is divided evenly between all. When only a few mobs.. this would be an aggravating type spell that does damage to each or a big blast if only one target. If a big blast is troubling, you could instead have each target take a maximum amount of damage, even if there is only one.

Enchant - Enchanting an item to have magical bonuses should be a quest in itself. A spell like this should severly tax MP. So much so, that only the highest level mages can perform it. It would require a very rare item, like a clover and even more than that. The max attribute bonus per casting should be 1 and can only be peformed a limited amount of times on one item. If that limit is 3, then a Rock knife could not be enchanted further as it already has a +3 Vitality bonus. I think it should go up to 9, myself, but that is an opinion. This could be a major headache to code in items, so IDK if it would ever come to light, but at least have a quest where we can do this. It would give players more to work towards, but if a player could cast it, you would need to befriend or have a mage to perform this 1. Maybe you can't enchant an already enchanted item.. so if you want a max value sword, you'd need all 9 clovers first, making those things rare, expensive and invaluable to the owner. IDK if I would trust just anyone with 9 clovers though. Let alone my weapon.

Fog - You already have different animations for fog. There are many cloud type spells in the RPG world. Some just inhibit your senses, other are fire based, poison, cold, suffocating, electrical. It would be great if this spell cast clouds based on your level. It could be random types, but the more powerful you are, the more powerful the clouds CAN be. Another area based spell that is a little unpredictable. No worries outside of PVP as it just shouldn't hurt players then. No different than warriors beating on a mob while arrows pass right through them. It can be explained away as the towns protective magic, just what you don't have in the Terranite caves.

Befriend - This is just a pet getting spell. Your pet may not do anything useful other than follow you or sit at your side, or maybe there is a small healing effect. I think any non aggressive mob should be able to be befriended, though an aggressive mob that also fights with you would be fun. It would be like summoned creatures, but never travels that far from you. Pets would slow down your movement rate though and would not warp places with you. It should run away before dying or run away from dangerous mobs before the encounter. No undead creature should be made a pet and the level of the mob could be quite limited. I'd like a Moggun or a Snake of some type ;-)

AstralJump - OK, this is weird and quite original. Le's say you have too many mobs around you, you can send one, possibly, to the astral plane, which is nothing but a map of a very large maze. You get no exp for this. It's just an aiding spell, unless you cast it on another in PVP (It should be tough to be successful). Mages could also travel there at will by sending themselves there and/or an NPC could be adding offering to take others there. The maze itself spawns nothing. The only occupants have been sent there by use of the spell. Starting empty and slowly filling more and more from the exiled mobs, this place could be very deadly or a walk in the park. It would be a free for all spawn place for GM's too. If a player dies there, they get sent to their last save stone, if they find an exit, they reappear in the place where they last where in TMW.

ControlOther - Mage must cast and remain stationary. I know of other servers where GM's could diguise themselves as a mob. It would be really neat if you could control a mob for a short duration(till MP meter runs out) and actually attack other mobs with it. You must not move offscreen of yourself or it will be broken. Your possessed victim would still be able to be attacked by players too, thus making it a tougher spell to make use of. Any damage done to caster, or other distractions (casting a spell on the caster, receiving a whisper, etc) would break this spell. Makes PVP more interesting too and overall fun everywhere else. I'd make a bat circle me or something neat.... maybe make a mob move away from a player.... or at one (but no attacking unless PVP)

Notes on alignments
That's it for spells, but dark vs light should also cause changes. Fighting too much in PVP... killing mouboo after you've gotten light magic. There needs to be negative consequences otherwise, players that have learned how to asorm become unstoppable in PVP. They do good deeds just to turn evil and have more power. The gods must punish these heretics and condemn them. Just as Dark mages could learn the power of good. Though that should be a big process too.

I know these are just ideas, but hopefully there are things that have not been thought of... Dispell magic, and a better detect magic are probably the most basic ones to fix up.

I'll look at some coding myself to see what i can actually understand. Maybe I can copy/paste myself a new script to share here instead of saying tha all annoying "You know what you guys should do?".

Thanks for reading. It took too long to do this post.

Ledmitz = Ardits = KillerBee = Mystic = Mystical_Servant = Tipsy Skeleton = BoomBoom = Cloak

User avatar
o11c
Grand Knight
Grand Knight
Posts: 2262
Joined: 20 Feb 2011, 21:09
Location: ^ ^

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by o11c »

Sounds like it would be a lot of work, and even then some of those are not feasible.
Former programmer for the TMWA server.
User avatar
veryape
TMW Adviser
TMW Adviser
Posts: 558
Joined: 06 Dec 2012, 12:08
Contact:

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by veryape »

I really like the idea about "reputation" and how it affects your magic. That would be really cool, an "evil" charachter can only learn the dark side of magic etc.

That would be so darn neat for role playing purposes, it kind of reminds me of Ultima Online and the player titles that people got depending on their actions and level. Check their system here -> fame and reputation

If something similar is possible to implement in this game it would be awesome!
Characters: veryape / Captain Dunce / Elvara / veryapeGM
tsukinokage
Peon
Peon
Posts: 32
Joined: 19 Sep 2012, 03:12

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by tsukinokage »

There're already a few level 3/4 magic spell in magic.conf.example, but still not in the game. And even if there aren't new level 3/4 magic spells, it's still odd and annoying to see that all magic is capped to level 2. I see no reason to not enable the maximum (which is leve 5) magic in the game. Even after you get level 5 magic you can still learn level 2 or even level 1 magic spell, so if someone say that the magic spell is not ready yet for the high level, so magic is capped to level 2 is still a strange opionion. I think every mage believe that the current in game experience of magic is annoying to them. And enable the maximum magic level is one of the solution to this feeling.

I was told that the magic system is supposed to change so that you can only master one type of magic(e.g. you can only get the fireball spell or other wise the teleport spell). But use such a don't know when it's to happen or will it every happen plan to hurdle the currently possible solution to magic experience changes is really odd and annoying. And even if you enable level 5 magic, and after that your implementation of only one magic type to choose is still feasible, since there are already two examples provide the solution, the first example is the introduction of astral soul skill reduces the overall damage of magic attack without this skill, the other example is that you can only focuse on one focusable skill. So if you enable the maximum level of magic, in the future you can still reduce the effect of all of the magic spell, only if you choose one type of magic as your magic topic (and possible to forgot other types of magic to focuse on the desired one). So yes, it's hard to find a mage good at every type of magic, but that means you can cast any type of magic spell with low effect or only one type of magic with maximum effect, or even you can be a master of one category of magic but still can cast e.g. level 2 other category of magic after your choose of magic path. And actually there're examples in other games that have the same logic with this system. Altough the battle of Wesnoth is not a MMORPG game like the kind of TMW, it have a unit called Elvish Shaman, who have healing ability, and after Elvish Shaman advanced to Elvish Druid her healing ability increases, if she advanced into Elvish Sorceress instead, her battling ability will increase, but she will lose her healing ability.

Although the current magic experience is annoying to mages, still there're quite a lot of mages love magic, so resist to be mages, and some of them choose to create alt (either to collect items for their mage character or to expereince alt style of playing) to reduce the annoying feeling. But I believe one reason why potential contributors (which I believe I myself is one) don't want to write new spells for TMW is just because even if they write the spells it won't come into the game (at least for maybe years).

Regards!
ali.footballist
Peon
Peon
Posts: 24
Joined: 06 Oct 2011, 12:13

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by ali.footballist »

i think that there should be a light magician and a dark magician in the game.
but what do u think the people who have high lvls do. should they start from the begining and try to improve their magic? i think it s too late to make these changes. developers should have made it before.
User avatar
Ledmitz
TMW Classic
TMW Classic
Posts: 583
Joined: 17 Aug 2011, 22:40
Location: The Mana World
Contact:

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by Ledmitz »

o11c wrote: Sounds like it would be a lot of work, and even then some of those are not feasible.
Do any of them look easy to implement? Could you recommend one that I might be able to do as a first script? The Joyplim, for instance.
tsukinokage wrote:There're already a few level 3/4 magic spell in magic.conf.example, but still not in the game. And even if there aren't new level 3/4 magic spells, it's still odd and annoying to see that all magic is capped to level 2.
I agree. I assume that the reason has to do with imbalance and that new NPC scripts would be needed. More quests too. It would be nice if magic were worked into more of the new quests when they're released to start giving us a little at a time. As for imbalance... yes it would temporarily, but I think that would change after again too.
ali.footballist wrote:i think that there should be a light magician and a dark magician in the game.
but what do u think the people who have high lvls do. should they start from the begining and try to improve their magic? i think it s too late to make these changes. developers should have made it before.
Because it is an open-sourced, ever-changing game, I don't think it should matter. If you chose to be good, then you have had a major advantage for a long time already, those that chose dark would finally have alternative magic, that they have been waiting for and deserve. If someone wants Dark magic, they can create a new character. I believe that is fair.

Ledmitz = Ardits = KillerBee = Mystic = Mystical_Servant = Tipsy Skeleton = BoomBoom = Cloak

User avatar
mistergrey
TMW Adviser
TMW Adviser
Posts: 535
Joined: 03 Jan 2010, 21:39

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by mistergrey »

For all the ones complaining about what developers Should have done, people have to realize... this game isn't a complete thing. It is added to, regularly, and the people making/adding new content have changed many times since it started. I'm a bit fuzzy on how much magic level affects magic damage right now, but I believe it has some effect, so enabling magic up to level 5 right now could just end in mages being considered overpowered again. Or, even just having a rather boring magic experience, when there's no point in training magic with all the new higher level spells available.

Ledmitz: first off, good job on putting a lot of thought into this. You made a lot of very good points, many of which are already planned or even made. I was the one working on magic level 3, and had finished almost everything planned, but there were a few setbacks. I had something come up in my personal life that required me to take some time away, so it has been sitting there, waiting heh. My main setback though, has been graphics. The game has virtually no active pixel artists left, and while I can do some limited art myself, I have not had great success trying to make my own spell effects. Most spells were fine, but in particular the newer attack spells could use some fresh graphic effects to make the wait seem more worthwhile, and to avoid getting too generic.

Light and Dark magic will have a greater focus - and many of the necessary spells that dark mages lack (betsanc, asorm) will either be available for both, or have a compensating evil version. You were right about summoning spells as well - dark mages will end up with a bit of an advantage there in the newer levels of magic.

I could address all of the ideas you've written, but I'd also like to avoid explaining everything that will be coming, so as to keep some surprise for the mages who have been patiently waiting for some new spells to throw around. You're more than welcome to message me if you have questions you really want more elaboration on, though.

More importantly though, don't take that as "I'm not answering questions, so stop" lol, it's really good that someone has bothered to make this topic and add some in depth suggestions of what they would like to see, and I hope that continues. There were enough things in your post that are definitely not in the magic currently finished - though some of those are also not entirely possible to add without some changes outside of magic (such as your AstralJump idea, which would require a new map, and some very specific writing to save a person's location [without making it their spawn point] when they are warped, and call back to that location when they find an exit).

I also agree that light vs dark should not be a reversible choice, or at least not as easily as changing what skill you focus on, or a level reset. It requires a few actions to qualify for light or dark magic, so it should take a sizeable effort to undo such a choice, if even.
Tiana wrote: I apologize if I gave anyone the impression that BC is the troll-king of the GM's. That title is rightfully held by mrgrey :P
<Mistakes> you are too difficult to troll

<Frost> Germans have Chess Boxing. English have Cheese Racing.
<Frost> I'm slightly terrified what the Russians consider violent sport.
<o11c> chatroulette

<Jaxad0127> YOu can't grab yourself.
<Jaxad0127> Elenore explicitly prevents it.
<Mistakes> speak for yourself
User avatar
Freeyorp101
Archivist Prime
Archivist Prime
Posts: 765
Joined: 04 Nov 2008, 09:17
Location: New Zealand

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by Freeyorp101 »

Firstly, let me say this is a wonderfully thought out post, and it's great to see someone take in interest in the magic system. It's been a while, and some of my information may be out of date, but I'll see if I can't take a look through this all. :)
Ledmitz wrote:Dark mages need another summoned creature. I suggest bats, snakes, scorpions... anything thought of as inherently evil.
This is a simple matter. You can look over the other summon spells for reference.
Ledmitz wrote:Reflect (dark) - The asorm for evil doers. It is not a shield, but an attack being sent back to the caster. I propose that this spell offers little to no actual protection per say, but that it has the possiblity to reflect some or all of the damage inflicted. Overall it should be the less guaranteed method of magic protection, but more vengeful in nature. whatever damage is not sent back, if any at all, will still effect the dark mage. An ingrav of 1000, might do 700hp to victim and 300hp to caster or totally vice versa.
Interesting idea. You'd need to implement another status effect for this, which will require some minor alterations to the server.
Ledmitz wrote:Miteyo - This is detect magic, but currently only detects certain npc's. I'd love to have it show players with spells cast on them, as well. If you are betsanc'd, then a detect magic should see that clearly, even if you can't see that it is a betsanc. Detecting magic on a player could be very useful in certain situations.
There are a few possibilities for this. An interesting possibility would be to make use of the CATALYST guard for an alternative spell branch, which searches nearby players in addition to the previous effect, which could be made into a procedure to avoid duplication. Note that particle effects are global.
Ledmitz wrote:Itenplz - Everyone loves this spell. It's a perfect example of how useful something so trivial can be. I heard it was made as a joke. One thing I'd like to see change, if possible is the ability to cancel the effects for your own spawns so that you don't need to run offscreen to have them attack mobs again. Maybe it could work more like a toggle on the friendlies, but this might be hard to implement.
The options for aggravate are very limited. You could install a new function into the magic language that checks the status of a mob, and at high levels you could have the spell skip over friendlies.
Ledmitz wrote:Parum - Needs no explaination really. Just needs more figurines. Of course having a purpose for these things might be good, like needing them for a quest or something. I guess if you are interesting in starting to make sprites, this might be a good place to start. It requires only one picture, I assume.
Adding new entries is simple. The limiting factor here will be in the creation of art and quests to support this. You don't necessarily need it to be the main part of a quest, but an NPC mentioning the name of something that can be used with this spell could be a neat aside for people that love digging in to this sort of thing. :)
Ledmitz wrote:Chiza - should automatically give the caster a plus on dex so they can actually hit mobs with it. The component is also not stackable. Maybe a stackable item could make this spell useful.

Upmarmu - ditto. Needs a dex bonus.
The magic system completely bypasses conventional combat mechanics. From memory, the equation used in the to-hit procedure for magical melee attacks could simply be expressed as spellpower - random(100) >= targetlevel + targetmdef. With sane mob values this would be quite an effective attack, unfortunately, last I checked, mob stats were still wonky. That's a big project, so as much as I hate to suggest it, it may be simpler just to adjust the to-hit equation used in the procedure - see magic.conf.
Ledmitz wrote:Joyplim - I know this spell is just for fun atm, but since it can be mischeivious, why not other plims? I thought it might be neat to simply change it so a joyplim would be a 3plim, devil face: 5plim, sick face: 1plim. The first number simply represent the corresponding alt shortcut. Would this be hard to do? Also, it would be quite funny to make NPC's and mobs smile too. It could even be used in a quest to help someone feeling down?
The first part wouldn't be hard to do, but I'd avoid breaking the fourth wall so directly. Why not come up with some new syllables and flesh out the magic language? :)

As to making it affect NPCs, I'm not sure whether npc() is safe with user-input. I'd want to look over the source to be sure.
You'd also need something to avoid it affecting quasi-NPCs. I can't think of an elegant solution off the top of my head to this, but it can be done. Perhaps a new #suffix, or a even check against a list of NPC sprite ids.
Ledmitz wrote:Skrimp - No use in the game, that I know of. It would be great if we could make potions or do other random things with it. I thought turning water into beer might be nice for a mage. or merging Iron and Conentration potions into one. I'm sure there's a use, but I haven't found it yet.
This quest was part of the road to magic level 3, and is incomplete. If you're keen to work in this area, I can't imagine anyone would object to making use of it. :)
Ledmitz wrote:Haste - This is already a spell, but has been commented out. I've always wondered why. It should be like a concentration potion and be done with 2 or less pedals and can only be cast on another

IronFist - The iron potion spell. Used like Haste.
If so, things have changed. The status effect existed, but I don't think there was a spell for it?
Ledmitz wrote:DispellMagic - One of the great things about being a mage is that you can undo your own blunders of magic cast by another. Obviously though, some magic in the game, should be permanent. This could undo betsancs, ingrav and other player cast spells if a succesul roll was made. It could also be used to make quests more interesting and puzzling.
I like the possibilities here. You might need to be careful to avoid race conditions if it's a straight dispell, as I can't recall whether magic has its own triggers runnning, but you might be able to move the status change timer to expire sooner.

This would need to be designed carefully. As more things are added, something like this has the potential to become an unmaintainable mudball of special snowflake code (frankly, that sums up all of tmwAthena last time I dropped by).
Ledmitz wrote:Drain(dark) - Rather than dark mages using Inma, they could get a Drain spell. It is more selfish and overall, less useful for exp, but could help one heal themselves from stealing life energy from others. I suggest that the amount gained is a fraction of the amount drained. Overuse could lead to negative consequences for the caster, as well.
Hm. A presumably PvP area exclusive spell has its downsides, but this could be interesting.

Ledmitz wrote:Cure(light)/Poison(dark) - Light magic would gain the ability the cure poisoned players, while Dark magic would cause living mobs only to be possibly poisoned, so long as they are not resistant based on their stats.
The former is already a level 3 spell. For the latter, I can't recall whether poison works properly on mobs. I remember from testing a while back that I could get the status effect to appear, but it might not have actually done anything behind the scenes.
Ledmitz wrote:Aid(light)/Hinder(Dark) - Adds or takes away from anothers stats. Adding accuracy or taking it away. This could also affect magic attack and defense. Cast on target only.
More status changes. See my comment for your proposed Reflect spell.
Ledmitz wrote:TurnUndead/Fear - This is a "Behold my Power" type spell. Think of it as a priest holding up a symbol to ward off the undead creatures or evoke fear in the living. This would cause normally aggressive mobs to disregard you, or Assisting mobs to not assist. It could repel mobs at higher levels away from the caster. The higher you are in magic attack, the more targets you can affect and the effects can increase with magic attack as well. In other RPG's Turning an undead or causing fear from a high level caster can inanimate the undead completely, or kill the living(Dark mages can usually control undead, but I'll cover that in another spell. I suggest damage instead. This should not require you to use a component unless it is something you carry in your inventory. The taxing should be on the MP and if any item is required, it could be a magical or holy symbol, like a cross, pentagram, or something like these, but original to TMW.
This is an ambitious spell. Aggravate doesn't have those options available, and I don't think there is any mob procedure for safely changing state in such a manner. You might be able to pull it off, but be warned. When mob behavior logic is concerned, here be dragons.
Ledmitz wrote:MakeScroll - It doesn't have to be a scroll, but a usable item that a mage can prepare and give to another player. After it's use, it would disintegrate or burn up. Any class could use a scroll, but the magic in it should have less power than that of the caster. You could limit them to certain spells for simplicity, but any protective and war spells should be able to be made. A player charged with a scroll would also be detectable with miteyo as explained above.
Not possible without substantial changes to the server, including: invoking spells from scripts, storing persistent data with item instances (you could fake this by having lesser/medium/greater/mastercrafted spell items if you don't mind drastic quantizing) in addition to substantial work in either registering/querying spells or having special snowflake code for every other spell in this one spell.

In short, not really practical.
Ledmitz wrote:PlayDead - I had 3 spells I condesed into 1 here. One was a portal to a safe place on the astral plane, another was to ward off all harm and magic, but playing dead seems more TMW style, so I went with that and it requires less work. Think of this as a pause button. Playing dead would cause a player to use the dead player animation, but still be alive(like @hide). Any movement, spellcasting, attacking, trading or any action other than talking and emotes(maybe not even allow this), would result in breaking the spell. This could be used for sabotage, to ward off players casting betsancs and joyplims on you as they would get a message stating there is no need to cast on the dead or something. All mobs would ignore you.
Use of GM perfect hide would drastically alter gameplay. There exists (existed?) some logic for partial player hide. I'm not sure if this is or was functional, and I doubt that everything TMW uses now would be covered to break the hide (though there does exist partial login protection that could possibly be repurposed)

I don't think the client can be made to display the dead sprite without processing dead logic.
Ledmitz wrote:Illusion - This one is simple... The mage casts the spell and it looks as though he/she has droped an item. The item that appears is random. It could be anything in the game. When a player goes to pick it up, they get a message saying that it has vanished before their eyes. This could be used to annoy those pesky drop stealers, cause havock and confusion during a drop party, and even entice mobs that loot to be interested. This should never be able to enter a trade window for obvious reasons and should require little to no components.
You'd need to modify the server for this. I don't think there are too many places that would need a check, as long as it could never enter an inventory.
Ledmitz wrote:Invisibility/Become shadow - I hm'd and haw'd over how to do this one. It would be nice if a mage could walk through mobs without them noticing them...A good way to get to the Cindy cave. Attacking and casting spells should reveal you. As for how players would perceive them, IDK what is right. Be invisible to everyone except GM's? Only show your name but not you? become a sillouette/shadow? At any rate.. something like this would be a nice addition but it's effects should be very temporary.
The most probably route for implementation for this would be the aforementioned partial player hide
Ledmitz wrote:Alarm - This would be an invisible object preferably, but could still be detected as magic. It does no more than send a message to the caster when a player or mob comes within it's working radius.
You might be able to implement this quite easily with a LOCAL spell and a loop which repeatedly checks entities in an area separated by WAIT.
Ledmitz wrote:Message - This could accomodate an alarm spell nicely. As a player goes within it's working radius a message is sent to general. This area is occupied. It would be great if you can leave custom messages. Not sure if this is possible. Tresspassers will be zapped on sight!!!
See above, though psuedo-NPCs created by LOCAL have a limited lifespan which reduces its practicality for communication
Ledmitz wrote:Warp - I know this is in the works. I hope it is limited in it's ability somehow. Limit to the current continent?
It exists and I believe it works, though unobtainable. No limitations were coded in, as far as I can remember.
Ledmitz wrote:MinorTeleport - ok.. this one is neat. Whatever direction the player is facing in is the direction of travel they will teleport to. They can only do so on the screen and it's distance should be random, but the maximum distance should be based on M. attack. Useful for moving faster, getting out of danger zones or even into them. It would give the mage a little edge on moving faster, which is why it should be hard on the magic meter.
Force staff for TMW? Hmmm. You could possibly implement this as a warp with a line of sight check. I'm not sure people would want it without a line of sight check, as it could make map and quest design very difficult. Easy to implement (and could be very fun), but difficult to balance.
Ledmitz wrote:Stun - Should affect attributes temporarily. Int and luck for sure... Agility and Dexterity too? All attributes? Like a knock in the noggin without the damage.
Status effects are far more flexible and safe than directly adjusting attributes.
Ledmitz wrote:Fireball - Another spell that has already been made. I propose that it can affect certain items, like logs and roots or other flammable things. You could setup some neat traps and fire barriers with it. Handling this outside of PVP could be tough, unless you had it not affect players unless in PVP. Is it possible to code an item on the ground to hurt others?
I don't think the magic system has anything about items, you'd probably need to add a new type to the system. There can be all sorts of interesting possibilities if this is done, though.
Ledmitz wrote:Seekers - This is multiple projectiles being hurdled simultaneously. If there is only one target, it takes all damage. 2 or more targets; damage is divided evenly between all. When only a few mobs.. this would be an aggravating type spell that does damage to each or a big blast if only one target. If a big blast is troubling, you could instead have each target take a maximum amount of damage, even if there is only one.
Projectiles are funky mostly because the client only exposes an aburdly limited subset of its awesome particle engine to server interaction; I think the "standard" way to implement projectiles has been to use an uber-fast mob and self-destruct. You can use the aggravate procedure to get mobs to attack a specific target.
Ledmitz wrote:Enchant - Enchanting an item to have magical bonuses should be a quest in itself. A spell like this should severly tax MP. So much so, that only the highest level mages can perform it. It would require a very rare item, like a clover and even more than that. The max attribute bonus per casting should be 1 and can only be peformed a limited amount of times on one item. If that limit is 3, then a Rock knife could not be enchanted further as it already has a +3 Vitality bonus. I think it should go up to 9, myself, but that is an opinion. This could be a major headache to code in items, so IDK if it would ever come to light, but at least have a quest where we can do this. It would give players more to work towards, but if a player could cast it, you would need to befriend or have a mage to perform this 1. Maybe you can't enchant an already enchanted item.. so if you want a max value sword, you'd need all 9 clovers first, making those things rare, expensive and invaluable to the owner. IDK if I would trust just anyone with 9 clovers though. Let alone my weapon.
See above for a comment on properties on items in the usual sense, but you can enumerate them if you can bear with it. Item crafting tiers has been an idea that has been constantly tossed around and last I checked had never really seen a concrete implementation.
Ledmitz wrote:Fog - You already have different animations for fog. There are many cloud type spells in the RPG world. Some just inhibit your senses, other are fire based, poison, cold, suffocating, electrical. It would be great if this spell cast clouds based on your level. It could be random types, but the more powerful you are, the more powerful the clouds CAN be. Another area based spell that is a little unpredictable. No worries outside of PVP as it just shouldn't hurt players then. No different than warriors beating on a mob while arrows pass right through them. It can be explained away as the towns protective magic, just what you don't have in the Terranite caves.
I'm not sure what you're meaning here. The duststorm is unfortunately a property of the map, and is not at all dynamic. You can have area-effect spells, such as arrow hail or rain.

Last I checked the client was doing something funky with the cache (I think it was fully re-parsing the particle effect definition for every raindrop?), so lots of little particle effects may (ironically) be out of the question due to load.
Ledmitz wrote:Befriend - This is just a pet getting spell. Your pet may not do anything useful other than follow you or sit at your side, or maybe there is a small healing effect. I think any non aggressive mob should be able to be befriended, though an aggressive mob that also fights with you would be fun. It would be like summoned creatures, but never travels that far from you. Pets would slow down your movement rate though and would not warp places with you. It should run away before dying or run away from dangerous mobs before the encounter. No undead creature should be made a pet and the level of the mob could be quite limited. I'd like a Moggun or a Snake of some type ;-)
I vaguely recall implementing a magic hook that made a target mob friendly but I'm not sure if it ever got in, adding new functions to the system doesn't take much though
Ledmitz wrote:AstralJump - OK, this is weird and quite original. Le's say you have too many mobs around you, you can send one, possibly, to the astral plane, which is nothing but a map of a very large maze. You get no exp for this. It's just an aiding spell, unless you cast it on another in PVP (It should be tough to be successful). Mages could also travel there at will by sending themselves there and/or an NPC could be adding offering to take others there. The maze itself spawns nothing. The only occupants have been sent there by use of the spell. Starting empty and slowly filling more and more from the exiled mobs, this place could be very deadly or a walk in the park. It would be a free for all spawn place for GM's too. If a player dies there, they get sent to their last save stone, if they find an exit, they reappear in the place where they last where in TMW.
I'm not sure what you mean here. Sorry!
Ledmitz wrote:ControlOther - Mage must cast and remain stationary. I know of other servers where GM's could diguise themselves as a mob. It would be really neat if you could control a mob for a short duration(till MP meter runs out) and actually attack other mobs with it. You must not move offscreen of yourself or it will be broken. Your possessed victim would still be able to be attacked by players too, thus making it a tougher spell to make use of. Any damage done to caster, or other distractions (casting a spell on the caster, receiving a whisper, etc) would break this spell. Makes PVP more interesting too and overall fun everywhere else. I'd make a bat circle me or something neat.... maybe make a mob move away from a player.... or at one (but no attacking unless PVP)
Disguise had been broken in unusual ways, mostly for the local player. Perhaps it's finally working again, but being able to ghost from your body, so to speak, sounds like something else altogether. I'm not sure how you'd go about doing this.


Some very nice ideas in there. It's great to see some creative thoughts bouncing around - even if not all can end up being done, there's still room for some and to make some pretty awesome stuff. :D
Please excuse me while my nostalgia goggles fog up


---Freeyorp
(09:58:17) < tux9th> Freeyorp: your sig on the forums is kind of outdated
User avatar
SriNitayanda
TMW Adviser
TMW Adviser
Posts: 394
Joined: 22 Oct 2012, 02:24

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by SriNitayanda »

I liked the idea of haste spell and iron fist spell, probably will be easier to implement cause the effects are already in the game.
User avatar
o11c
Grand Knight
Grand Knight
Posts: 2262
Joined: 20 Feb 2011, 21:09
Location: ^ ^

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by o11c »

Please make sure to talk to me before:
  • make any internal changes to the server
  • trying to use any effect that is implemented server-side but is not currently used
In particular, I'll block "soft hide" and "poisonous attacks" since the code for that was very complicated.

In general, I would like to avoid any changes to the combat system, as that is probably the part of the code I understand the least.

Note that I have plans to change the syntax of the magic file to make it more computer-parseable so I can fix the internal data structures and in turn finally plug all the memory leaks. The magic system is definitely the lowest *quality* of code in TMWA, but at least it's relatively easy to understand ...
Former programmer for the TMWA server.
User avatar
mistergrey
TMW Adviser
TMW Adviser
Posts: 535
Joined: 03 Jan 2010, 21:39

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by mistergrey »

There are spells written out that make use of the poison status effect, though as Freeyorp said, I only got as far as confirming that the effect appears on mobs, haven't really seen if it works yet. Still, in a worst case where we can never inflict useful status effects on monsters, I believe poison is listed amongs the elemental affiliations, so such spells could still function effectively against mobs that are made to be weak to poison.

If anyone is capable of looking into the status effects we can use, and maybe has some free time, magic would be much more fun if we had a few specific effects, such as drastically slowing mobs, stunning (though there were some issues with that idea that I recall), perhaps even some kind of "weaken" effect that increases damage inflicted on the target. Of course, this depends on how status effects apply to mobs to begin with.
Tiana wrote: I apologize if I gave anyone the impression that BC is the troll-king of the GM's. That title is rightfully held by mrgrey :P
<Mistakes> you are too difficult to troll

<Frost> Germans have Chess Boxing. English have Cheese Racing.
<Frost> I'm slightly terrified what the Russians consider violent sport.
<o11c> chatroulette

<Jaxad0127> YOu can't grab yourself.
<Jaxad0127> Elenore explicitly prevents it.
<Mistakes> speak for yourself
User avatar
Ledmitz
TMW Classic
TMW Classic
Posts: 583
Joined: 17 Aug 2011, 22:40
Location: The Mana World
Contact:

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by Ledmitz »

Wow, TY for the posts on this everyone. It looks like Freeyorp took some time into replying. So many have an interest in this. I must admit, I get a little over ambitious at times. Right now I am about to get and learn how to use the adler32 script, so that I can complete my update host for extra sfx in the game without having to manually edit the file this time. I'd also like to see if I can implement music changes properly, by tagging maps with custom tracks made by myself and others. Hopefully things will run smooth. I had started to setup a google site for updates, before I remembered someone telling me that GIT is the optimal method. I can see why now, though this means learning GIT too. As soon as I get it up and running, I'll peer into some of the things that Freeyorp mentioned so that I can understand better what he means. I am not a programmer and couldn't write a script without looking at an example, but I believe I can hack my way into understanding the fundamentals a little better. I want to do it all, but only so much time. I also believe I may be missing fundamental files to look at easiliy, so it might be time that I clone the server data GIT, as well. I just copied the client-data last night to create my update patch.
I feel I should look at the summon spells for dark magic and parum. Updating parum means I either collaborate with some pixel artists or that I create my own, meaning learning even more again. But before doing any work on those, I will confer with Mr.Grey to make sure that what I am trying to do has not already been done. Maybe you can point me in the right direction of where to begin, so that you don't spoil any suprises, Mr.Grey ... ?
Ledmitz wrote:Drain(dark) - Rather than dark mages using Inma, they could get a Drain spell. It is more selfish and overall, less useful for exp, but could help one heal themselves from stealing life energy from others. I suggest that the amount gained is a fraction of the amount drained. Overuse could lead to negative consequences for the caster, as well.
Freeyorp101 wrote:Hm. A presumably PvP area exclusive spell has its downsides, but this could be interesting.
Not PVP only, but that the inma spell changes to a different one when cast by a dark mage. I thought an If/Else statement would be enough. IDK if this requires a separate file for dark magic or if it should be contained in magic.conf. I don't know the code, but here's the logic:
IF status == 'DarkMage' DO var 'DarkInma/Drain'
ELSE IF DO 'LightInma/Inma'
It's just a different consequence for casting the same incantation.. ?
Ledmitz wrote:Ledmitz wrote:
Fog - You already have different animations for fog. There are many cloud type spells in the RPG world. Some just inhibit your senses, other are fire based, poison, cold, suffocating, electrical. It would be great if this spell cast clouds based on your level. It could be random types, but the more powerful you are, the more powerful the clouds CAN be. Another area based spell that is a little unpredictable. No worries outside of PVP as it just shouldn't hurt players then. No different than warriors beating on a mob while arrows pass right through them. It can be explained away as the towns protective magic, just what you don't have in the Terranite caves.
Freeyorp101 wrote:I'm not sure what you're meaning here. The duststorm is unfortunately a property of the map, and is not at all dynamic. You can have area-effect spells, such as arrow hail or rain.

Last I checked the client was doing something funky with the cache (I think it was fully re-parsing the particle effect definition for every raindrop?), so lots of little particle effects may (ironically) be out of the question due to load.
I wondered if an effect with no animation could take place in the same area at the same time as the non-tangible, partially transparent, sprite layer (clouds). Then all within the visible cloud would suffer the effects of it. It could be just one big cloud, not many animations.... showing dmg inflicted could still be done in the usual particle sense(white sparks/poison)



I guess I'll stop there for now.. I still have to clean up this house before I can finish my new update server. I can't wait to peer into magic more.

Ledmitz = Ardits = KillerBee = Mystic = Mystical_Servant = Tipsy Skeleton = BoomBoom = Cloak

User avatar
Jenalya
TMW Adviser
TMW Adviser
Posts: 717
Joined: 22 Sep 2010, 19:28

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by Jenalya »

Ledmitz wrote: Updating parum means I either collaborate with some pixel artists or that I create my own, meaning learning even more again.
There's a start on a Yeti figurine: https://trello.com/card/yeti-figurine-i ... 00497e/191
And since the names used in the parum spell are supposed to be words in the old Tritan language, I contacted Fate (the original magic developer) about that topic. Here are some extracts of our communication. (This was about one year ago. )
I didn't do much background for the Triton language, to be honest. Also, it has been awhile, and there are no extant notes on that topic
My current intuition would be that the Tritons were the first to find magic, in the depths of the oceans. (That theme incidentally connects to the mana seed's later birth in a pond.) They thus rose to early prominence and got to shape magic (and were shaped by it) before the other races
Since they were an aquatic race, their language was or is (I'm notsure if they still exist) a bit different from land-based languages in that it is tonal and does not include fricatives. The word `boo' for mouboo suggests that it was an old word for them, and indeed it is a`resurrected' word that they used to use for sea-antilopes, which were long extinct by thetime Tritans mastered magic to the extent that let them leave the seasand walk on land. `Boo' was, for a while, a word they used for all land-creatures, untilthey encountered other intelligent species and found a need to discriminate better
At this point I don't think that tonality matters much in magic anymore (though somecomplex rituals and incantations that have seen little use since thedays of the Tritons still might-- but this is more of relevance to NPCs than to player-cast spells.) You can use the lack of fricatives to guide your search for other Triton stems of modern words, though.
> His idea for a Triton name was 'Iati'. Do you think that fits?
> For the spell it would be '#parum ti'

So the yeti is in game now. The figure needs a bit more work, though; it has no shading to speak of.

Linguistically I would go for `ladi' to avoid the fricative, but you could make a valid argument that at the point where the Tritons would have encountered Yeti, they would have been living on land for a while(and hence might have adopted the `t'). For game purposes, you should only use `di' if there is an in-game hint to that extent (e.g., a book that recounts a traveller's encounter with the Tritons.)

> We're working on some snow area extensions at the moment and there is a
> village of a tribe of hunters and gatherers planned.
> They're into traditions and after reading your background story about the
> Tritons, I wonder if it fits to give them some legends about the Tritons
> that visited their land an ancient time ago and left some influences in
> their language.

I like that idea! This might work better than a book. They couldhave old songs that they inherited from the Tritons, instead of written accounts.

Another idea to keep in mind: the Tritons could plausibly have been cold-blooded. The snowlands would thus have been far more dangerous to them than to most other creatures. I wonder what kinds of magic they developed to deal with that challenge, or why they even ventured up into such dangerous territory?
User avatar
Ledmitz
TMW Classic
TMW Classic
Posts: 583
Joined: 17 Aug 2011, 22:40
Location: The Mana World
Contact:

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by Ledmitz »

Thank you Jenalya, I read this a while ago, but didn't reply yet. I will consult with you about a name and check out the unfinished work first. :)

Ledmitz = Ardits = KillerBee = Mystic = Mystical_Servant = Tipsy Skeleton = BoomBoom = Cloak

bell chick
Novice
Novice
Posts: 141
Joined: 11 Dec 2012, 06:52

Re: New Spell Ideas and Revisiting Older Ones

Post by bell chick »

just one small idea into how you could do the barbarians once encountering the tritons. instead of going into a complex story about the tritons in snow areas, which does'nt really make sense, you could go further into the origins of the barbarians, who in ancient times could've lived anywhere. i would say most likely the sea where they couldve encountered a race such as the tritons. in an environment not nearly as harsh as nivalis they likely would've had more mages and scholars among them that could've learned this language. then for whatever reason they leave their homeland (could be famine, war or exile) and go to live in the snowfields. with the harsh environments and the struggle tyo survive many of the mages and scholars didn't make makit. the harsh environment caused them to take on a harsher caste and hence the barbarians we know today. by taking this approach you could say that the ancient barbarian mages and scholars having learned the triton language thus gave the ancient name to the yeti derived from some ancient sea animal. and this story couldve been passed through the generations.


not sure this approach works but my idea was to instead of giving more about the tritons, a race we havent encontered, it'd be cool to go further into where the barbarians came from, a race we all know and love
Post Reply