Fair enoughAmun wrote:I'll let you answer that when all is said and done.
MK
Fair enoughAmun wrote:I'll let you answer that when all is said and done.
Seems this was misinterrupted, judging by the preceding scripts.Delasia wrote:But Amun, if you automated everything, you would have no one to abuse and accuse. You would have no one to talk to because all would have you on ignore...(something GMs cannot do), and in the end no scapegoat for your own misinterruptions and inadequacies.
Your trolling days would be over......
Are you sure thats what you want..?/
Yeah, this might work for most CAPSLOCK bandits (and you know, all those warriors who stack would probably love this too). I'm sure even the most retarded botter could code a bot that could moves every 30 seconds. If your concept of a botter is someone who just stands there and swings a sword, you are sorely mistaken. Bots that stand in one location for just around the amount of drop protection and then walk off a grid around the spot they were standing is pretty easy. Automation tools that record keystrokes and replay them are super easy, like AutoIt or Autohotkey.Amun wrote: I heard adamix mention that and I agree it would be annoying as crap. But could you not do something more simple? Such as: if player x is stationary in <location> for x amount of minutes <send botcheck> which would be as simple as an automated message asking them to move in x amount of time or they will be kicked / banned the same as gm's currently do.
Galadriel, I think you have misunderstood something about GMs. It is just some nice extra we have been doing announcements for player events. The actual duty of a GM is to enforce the rules. And along with that comes warning players because of some abuse towards other players. I don't know about your case and I can't tell whether or not it was justified some GM came to you to warn you, but that indeed belongs to a GM's duties.Galadriel wrote: I personally vote for the removal of any visible GMs. I'm sure GMs serve a purpose... like announcing up-and-coming weddings, etc. a quick @wgm please announce this: "blah" works just fine.
Let me clarify:Katze wrote:Galadriel, I think you have misunderstood something about GMs. It is just some nice extra we have been doing announcements for player events. The actual duty of a GM is to enforce the rules. And along with that comes warning players because of some abuse towards other players. I don't know about your case and I can't tell whether or not it was justified some GM came to you to warn you, but that indeed belongs to a GM's duties.Galadriel wrote: I personally vote for the removal of any visible GMs. I'm sure GMs serve a purpose... like announcing up-and-coming weddings, etc. a quick @wgm please announce this: "blah" works just fine.
Of the rules enforced: my observation is that few or none get banned for speaking other languages; few get banned for spamming; and few get banned for abusive behaviour.salmondine wrote:I think it is a good idea to try it.
I like our GM's too.
But most of MY reasons for wanting GM's in the first place are fixed.
Drop stealing is fixed.
auto - ban takes care of spammers.
This leaves botting- well who cares, this server will be abandoned or wiped as promised.
Who cares if you are lvl 99 on a stagnant soon to be abandoned server.
Sheesh we are pre-alpha, and will always be until we are replaced.
There will always be obnoxious, rude and insulting players, that is what ignore is for!
Which ones do so regularly while wearing their GM outfits?Galadriel wrote:He doesn't park in town to demonstrate to the world that he's a GM. I believe MK treats the work he does as a responsibility, not as a way to lord it over others.
I think that can lead to an ugly gray area.jaxad0127 wrote:Which ones do so regularly while wearing their GM outfits?Galadriel wrote:He doesn't park in town to demonstrate to the world that he's a GM. I believe MK treats the work he does as a responsibility, not as a way to lord it over others.
Code: Select all
Code? What code?
That's seems to be true, at least partially. If you'll read GM logs (or simply watch what happens in-game) you will soon figure out that GMs are (at least sometimes) using more special commands than really necessary to perform their tasks. Probably they doing this for convenience, etc. But that could reasonably annoy usual players. In my own opinition, GMs may exist, but players should never see special commands usage unless there is something terribly wrong happens and necessary evil have to be applied. Otherwise GMs are doomed to feel a numbers of hateful eyes and read unpleasant comments. IMHO, good staff is not visible until something goes really wrong. Invisible - in sense of administrative power usage. It is ok if GM wants to be usual player, but then GM do not have to use administrative commands for own convenience or to favor one players over others, etc. Or this will annoy other players (they will feel like they're second-rate citizens, hence all these hateful comments, etc).Amun wrote:They only add a sense of corruption amongst the majority of the community. Which is warranted.
Really? Maybe you can publish your algorithm allowing to do it, then? Which will not cause false positives (ban of innocent people is unacceptable) but will ban even advanced and tricky bots who crafted to behave a bit more like a real player and say, keeps XP growth rate not very high to avoid simple and non-intrusive methods of detection? I bet your algo will be used not just here in TMW if you will manage to invent such algo, he-he .Most gm tasks could be automated through server side scripting. (including the banning / kicking of bots)
This will cause same issue as with GMs. People will dislike "privileged" players for same reasons they dislike GMs, I guess . Why someone should have more rights than someone else? I can at least sometimes find answer on this question for GMs, but unable to find it for usual players, even events organisers. What if some Average Joe wants to organise event? Should Joe to be allowed to announce it? Or he should feel like a second rate citizen?Monthly events and announcements could be hosted and done by game event organisers which would only need limited permissions.
Somewhat true, that's why I think GMs should be less visible (in terms of administrative commands usage). But what you will do if someone let's say found bug (or whatever) which allows other player to effectively stop you (or what worse, many people at once) from normal playing? Will you wait for days or weeks until this could be fixed (not each and every issue can be fixed quickly) or attacker satisfied with effect and gives up? If you think this can't happen, well, this means you just did not noticed some things.Most people are able to deal with their own issues or problems within the game just as efficient as a gm.
Well, again. This is a testing time, right? And as stated: MasterKenobi shows up in game and does his rounds invisibly. (I'd love it if he posted a thread or post describing a day in his TMW duties.) True, he does become visable and speaks to others. (I'm not suggesting he's forbidden to do so.) But much of his work is done invisibly. From recent discussions with him (now that he's more visible) he does not appear to be too "burned out". But that's more for him to say.Ceros wrote:I understand the need for GMs to be both hidden and in plain sight. It is similar to why there are plain clothes police officers and uniformed officers, marked cars and unmarked cars. While a GM who remained hidden 24/7, only appearing to ban a botter and constantly on the prowl would be nice, it is pretty unrealistic. No one wants to spend their time on this server unmet and unnoticed. The GM burn out rate would be extremely high.
+1 CerosCeros wrote:At the same time, to continue the cop analogy, you don't want to have that one cop who goes around all the time in uniform, waving their badge around to get 'cop discounts', who tries to get phone numbers by pulling over hot chicks and letting them off with a warning. However, at the same time, a cop who always walks a beat and is easily approachable is fosters a sense of security and serves the community. But it is a very fine line.