The Mana World Forums

Then again, not everybody should HAVE to look at the GM logs to figure out who is who. It would be confusing and the GM logs take 1 hour to load anyway.

Chicka-Maria wrote:

bell chick wrote:the game does need something beyond level 99. not sure what and i dont think levels are the answer but the games lifespan should be more than the 6 months it takes to reach 99

6 months? I been on this server for almost 4 years and I'm 93 lol

nearing 4 months in and im level 96. i probably wont get 99 within 2 months but, its fully possible at this point. im slowing down to savor it a little.

v0id wrote:(how would GMs easily track past actions of a given player?)

Crush wrote:How would anyone track past actions of any other player?

Account number

Crush wrote:You could be a total jerk and when everyone hates you, you just rename your character and nobody will recognize you anymore.

Player might want to change role, and not start fro the beginning again

Nard wrote:Player might want to change role, and not start fro the beginning again

they can do that without changing their name.

Nard wrote:

Crush wrote:You could be a total jerk and when everyone hates you, you just rename your character and nobody will recognize you anymore.

Player might want to change role, and not start fro the beginning again

Being a jerk is not roleplaying. It's being an awful person.

Chicka-Maria wrote:lol @ real cash.

Seriously, why not? It's not an uncommon model in the open source world. When people (usually corporations) need a specific feature in an open source program, they pay people to implement this feature for them. Most of the current development of the Linux kernel is financed that way. Crowdfunding the development of features or content when the TMW team lacks the manpower to do it themself might be a viable model for TMW.

Crush wrote:

Chicka-Maria wrote:lol @ real cash.

Seriously, why not? It's not an uncommon model in the open source world. When people (usually corporations) need a specific feature in an open source program, they pay people to implement this feature for them. Most of the current development of the Linux kernel is financed that way. Crowdfunding the development of features or content when the TMW team lacks the manpower to do it themself might be a viable model for TMW.

Sorry but the mana world should remain free, players shouldn't have to pay developers to get what they want in the game. Developers volunteer their time and not get paid for it, it should stay this way.

regards,

bjorn is currently in pay-for-features mode with Tiled.


As for TMW, I think there's a *lot* of value in being able to say it's completely free. But, pay-for-features is not necessarily at odds with that goal - it's not like it's paying for something to directly benefit yourself and not benefit others. There would need to be some guidelines, however, and this is not something we've ever had to consider.

As for me, I'm not in that much of a position to have more free time if I were getting paid. The thing that's most valuable to me right now is getting experience that is recognized by the industry.

If people got paid for what they did there would possibly no such thing as a volunteer anymore, almost every developer would want to get paid for their time and their work. The developers that contribute should be priceless... Other wise be prepared to be paying a whole bunch of developers for their work not just one or possibly two.

It's also not fair to the players that cannot afford to say "i want this in game here is 50 euros an hour for it".

This game has attracted many players because of its open source FREE game and hard work of volunteers it would ruin the reputation completely.

regards,

bell chick wrote:the game does need something beyond level 99. not sure what and i dont think levels are the answer but the games lifespan should be more than the 6 months it takes to reach 99

6 months to reach 99! are you joking?

nearing 4 months in and im level 96. i probably wont get 99 within 2 months but, its fully possible at this point. im slowing down to savor it a little.

Then either you are not a new player and forgot the time it took to you to understand the game; or you got a very strong and very long help, and surely need to sleep a lot.
If you do not need to sleep, posting such comments may attract GM attention on you.
edit:
96 +97 is 106,822,000 exp.so roughly the same as to get level 92; and a bit more than:
98 to 99 which is 100,000,000 exp: at 20,000 exp/min it makes 833h, so 34 days of continuous play or 52 at 16h a day, 104 at 8 h/day...

o11c wrote:bjorn is currently in pay-for-features mode with Tiled.


As for TMW, I think there's a *lot* of value in being able to say it's completely free. But, pay-for-features is not necessarily at odds with that goal - it's not like it's paying for something to directly benefit yourself and not benefit others. There would need to be some guidelines, however, and this is not something we've ever had to consider.

As for me, I'm not in that much of a position to have more free time if I were getting paid. The thing that's most valuable to me right now is getting experience that is recognized by the industry.

I don't like pay for feature Idea which will make the developer follow those who give the most. I far more prefer the shareware one, or even the commercial one which are clearer to users. If money is required to help the project, I prefer Platyna's method or selling goodies which are widely used in free software community.

Some features have already requested several times on this forum:

• real Guild support: Chat, Storage, bank, shop, member hierarchy, schools, alliances(not only chat)
• pets
• mounts
• language/chat channels (could include permanent gm and dev channels)

I would add:

• castles which would give real game meaning and fun to guilds and PvP

I dont like 99 as a limit because 99 is a multiple of 11, 9 and 3. 100 is better, 120 even more...

I can't see how levels upper to 99 would break balance more than New illia items already did it (I like them). We already see that new content is necessary to avoid that easier 90 to 99 make 60 to 90 much more difficult.

Chicka-Maria wrote:If people got paid for what they did there would possibly no such thing as a volunteer anymore, almost every developer would want to get paid for their time and their work. The developers that contribute should be priceless... Other wise be prepared to be paying a whole bunch of developers for their work not just one or possibly two.

It's also not fair to the players that cannot afford to say "i want this in game here is 50 euros an hour for it".

This game has attracted many players because of its open source FREE game and hard work of volunteers it would ruin the reputation completely.

regards,

The thing is there are people like me who have reached a skill level allowing them to actually make money with their development skills. As you know I am not contributing to TMW anymore. Why? Because I don't see why I should program for TMW for free when I get paid when doing the same thing for my employer.

I don't like pay for feature Idea which will make the developer follow those who give the most.

That's not how it would work. When a bunch of players would hire a programmer to implement a guild system, the programmer would fork the tmwAthena source on github, implement it in that fork exactly according to their specifications, and then open a pull request. It would then be the decision of the TMW developers to accept it or not and the job of those who hired the programmer to convince them to do so. When the TMW developers refuse to accept it, and the programmer implemented the specifications correctly, that would be none of his business. He did what he was paid to do. Those who hired him should have made sure that what they paid for has a chance to get included.

Nard wrote:

bell chick wrote:the game does need something beyond level 99. not sure what and i dont think levels are the answer but the games lifespan should be more than the 6 months it takes to reach 99

6 months to reach 99! are you joking?

nearing 4 months in and im level 96. i probably wont get 99 within 2 months but, its fully possible at this point. im slowing down to savor it a little.

Then either you are not a new player and forgot the time it took to you to understand the game; or you got a very strong and very long help, and surely need to sleep a lot.
If you do not need to sleep, posting such comments may attract GM attention on you.
edit:
96 +97 is 106,822,000 exp.so roughly the same as to get level 92; and a bit more than:
98 to 99 which is 100,000,000 exp: at 20,000 exp/min it makes 833h, so 34 days of continuous play or 52 at 16h a day, 104 at 8 h/day...

some help yes. mainly with armor. understanding of stats came from past rpgs (been playing rpgs since i was 12 so thpough there were trial and error periods and resets i know how to get bang fpor my buck. the gms are welcome to come check me at any time on beliala as the only time im afk is when im motionless. oh and ftr my xp rate is a constant 35k a minute as warrior right now and can be as high as 96k a minute with potions and effort. the estimates im giving arent unheard of. villain got to 99 in a total of 7 months with the implementaion of the illia items such time is brought even shorter

Crush wrote:

Chicka-Maria wrote:If people got paid for what they did there would possibly no such thing as a volunteer anymore, almost every developer would want to get paid for their time and their work. The developers that contribute should be priceless... Other wise be prepared to be paying a whole bunch of developers for their work not just one or possibly two.

It's also not fair to the players that cannot afford to say "i want this in game here is 50 euros an hour for it".

This game has attracted many players because of its open source FREE game and hard work of volunteers it would ruin the reputation completely.



regards,

The thing is there are people like me who have reached a skill level allowing them to actually make money with their development skills. As you know I am not contributing to TMW anymore. Why? Because I don't see why I should program for TMW for free when I get paid when doing the same thing for my employer.

I don't like pay for feature Idea which will make the developer follow those who give the most.

That's not how it would work. When a bunch of players would hire a programmer to implement a guild system, the programmer would fork the tmwAthena source on github, implement it in that fork exactly according to their specifications, and then open a pull request. It would then be the decision of the TMW developers to accept it or not and the job of those who hired the programmer to convince them to do so. When the TMW developers refuse to accept it, and the programmer implemented the specifications correctly, that would be none of his business. He did what he was paid to do. Those who hired him should have made sure that what they paid for has a chance to get included.

Sorry but just because people like you find a job with your skills, it doesn't give people like you the right to try to change a *free* game and say "i know this, pay me or i wont do it". Like i said before the mana world is based off volunteers for the project and it should stay that way.

Players shouldn't have to pay a developer to do things. It's sad you don't contribute anymore because of money but that is your choice and nobody can say what you have to do with your time, But when it comes to The Mana World being *FREE* it should stay that way and shouldn't have to change because of developers that demand profit in order to contribute to this community.

Also, People volunteer mostly because they enjoy learning and enjoy volunteering their time to a community they bond with and to a game they enjoy.. The only reason why i spend any time on this project at all is because im passionate about the game and the morals of it being a free for all, and the game built up on hard working volunteers that dont demand profit...I really admire that. Also That's why a lot of developers (I've talked to) don't demand money.

regards,

Don't worry, Chicka-Maria. I am not really serious about this, I am just hypothesizing. But let me suggest another entirely hypothetical scenario.

Imagine I would say that I would announce my return to TMW development. Over the next weeks I would create some amazing new features, like a guild system, an guildwar system, a pet system and many other cool things. The other developers love them, the improvements go online and the community loves them.

Then, after about a month, I let slip that I didn't actually did anything of that myself. I hired some Chinese programmers to program it and paid them from my own money. Don't worry about licensing, I made sure that all copyrights were transfered to me and I released it under GNU GPL. How would you react and how would it change your view of me and of TMW in general?