The Mana World Forums

So, can you, as an objective observator point me the conclusion you have received from this log? ;)

Grats, Bjorn, you just admitted fighting with me to give the people the privileges they don't need.

Regards.

Bjørn wrote:And, I didn't ask Platyna to leave because I'm not appreciating her contribution to this game.

But in fact it looks that way.

Bjørn wrote:Nov 16 21:06:21 <b_lindeijer> She also thinks having some devs as GM and some others not will make the devs that are not GMs unhappy and leave.

Yep, that's also very reasonable. It only creates stress atmosphere between dev team members.

Platyna wrote:looks like I know people since Vink makes a very good GM, while Katze made people mad in her first three days of GMship.

That is also true.

Bjørn - your decision sucks. And I'm afraid you know that.

And thanks to people like Jaxad, who makes rude remarks, such as "Geez, Platyna leaves every three days [dont treat her seriously]".

I do not leave every three days, I was offten leaving the channels when discussion became annoying it is not the same as to leave or being told to leave the project I spent three years on.

Regards.

Platyna wrote:And thanks to people like Jaxad, who makes rude remarks, such as "Geez, Platyna leaves every three days [dont treat her seriously]".

I do not leave every three days, I was offten leaving the channels when discussion became annoying it is not the same as to leave or being told to leave the project I spent three years on.

Regards.

When did I say that? We're not the only ones making rude remarks, by the way.

It seems you have forgot I have AI bot on the channels (and I have to recompile it to change configs, so I am lazy):

21:53 < rmaureira> gee, found a really interesting project (this one) and already found a dev leaving and all sorts of finger pointing... lol
21:54 < Jaxad0127> rmaureira: platyna does that occasionaly

19:54 < Jaxad0127> it's back
19:55 < Jaxad0127> platyna swpet it under the rug
19:55 < Jaxad0127> *swept

Etc. etc.

Regards.

Platyna wrote:

19:54 < Jaxad0127> it's back
19:55 < Jaxad0127> platyna swpet it under the rug
19:55 < Jaxad0127> *swept

I don't know a better way of describing what you did with this thread: http://forums.themanaworld.org/viewtopi ... =12&t=5263. It was locked and parked (moved to the parking lot, where threads go to receive moderation).

Sure, and some nice person moved it back. :o) Moderators solidarity like hell.

Regards.

On many occasions Platyna and i have not seen eye to eye, however on this we are(i think) agreed.

The GMs as moderators and arbitors of the world and its players should not be confused with the Devs as creators of the world in which the players play. There is no real need for the Devs to have significant powers within the baseline world(possibly @warp to test an NPC or other situation) and if a test server with sufficient players is available even that isn't necessary.

Sincerely, Jarv

Jarvellis wrote:On many occasions Platyna and i have not seen eye to eye, however on this we are(i think) agreed.

The GMs as moderators and arbitors of the world and its players should not be confused with the Devs as creators of the world in which the players play. There is no real need for the Devs to have significant powers within the baseline world(possibly @warp to test an NPC or other situation) and if a test server with sufficient players is available even that isn't necessary.

Sincerely, Jarv

Indeed. Test and official game servers should be separated. It's all about it.

i wrote:Indeed. Test and official game servers should be separated. It's all about it.

Well, I'm sure everybody will agree with you there. And as far as I know Crush, Fate and Jaxad0127 are all already running their own servers in order to test the content changes before they are applied to the official server. I'm doing the same. It has already been stated that peavey and Crush don't absolutely need their GM rights. Nobody except Platyna ever made a big issue out of them actually having those rights, though, which seems to make her arguments against it rather moot.

The recent argument with peavey wasn't because he had those rights, which I know he would be ready to give up, but it was because Platyna accused him of abusing his rights. She totally forgot to take into account that peavey is a very reasonable person with a very close relationship with the game and its community. This was really insulting, and ultimately why I asked Platyna to no longer get involved, because peavey wasn't the first one encountering this kind of personal abuse from Platyna.

In the past my GM rights on the real server turned out to be quite useful. One time for performance testing stuff which needs some people on the screen and one time for researching a script bug which could not be reproduced on a local server for some reason.

The item spawning rights also turn out handy to test new features after they have been released on the official server to make sure that the server admins made no mistakes while updating the server.

I also use the @warp and @jump commands a lot to get around quickly so I can get a better overview of how the players react on new features.

Bjørn wrote:

i wrote:Indeed. Test and official game servers should be separated. It's all about it.

Well, I'm sure everybody will agree with you there. And as far as I know Crush, Fate and Jaxad0127 are all already running their own servers in order to test the content changes before they are applied to the official server. I'm doing the same. It has already been stated that peavey and Crush don't absolutely need their GM rights. Nobody except Platyna ever made a big issue out of them actually having those rights, though, which seems to make her arguments against it rather moot.

Of course it is moot, they want power, and I don't want them to have this power, and many respectect community members agreed with me.
And you, despite the fact you agreed that they don't this powers persist, and you are telling me to leave if I disagree.
Furthermore, if I would say - my hosting or those people at power, you would move the server elsewhere.
Blatant example how much you care about your ambitions and how much you care about the good of the project.

Your problem is you don't care about anything else than to prove you can win with me. I can't find any other logic explanation of such conduct.

Peavey, Crush, you have shown to the whole community here - that you have no dignity and no honour, and all you care is power, even for the price of splitting the people who, for long years, were very well working with each other. Such people already deranged and/or destroyed many good projects.
Such people like you, are poisonous for any project they join, even you draw or code, you are doing more harm than good, by your desires to gain power you don't need and to make old friends argue with each other.

Bjorn always was treating me with respect and taking into account my opinion and my suggestions - before you started to depreciate me and demand power.

I can't imagine such people being developers, or, what is even worse, commuity moderators, when you are having problems even if server admin's order of files.

Free online games are not about items and levels, they are about the community and the team, the one which you attempt to destroy to have level 80.

The recent argument with peavey wasn't because he had those rights, which I know he would be ready to give up, but it was because Platyna accused him of abusing his rights. She totally forgot to take into account that peavey is a very reasonable person with a very close relationship with the game and its community. This was really insulting, and ultimately why I asked Platyna to no longer get involved, because peavey wasn't the first one encountering this kind of personal abuse from Platyna.

I did not accused them, he abused the powers blatantly, in front of almost whole community, what I was supposed to say? "Oh peavey, peavey, you did poo, poo"?. Not to mention how do you know how close he is to the community, if you are not playing the game and you have blatantly admitted you are not reading most of posts here (and you kept insisting for years that forums are not important and not useful at all, now your power hungry minions are demanding powers also on forums).

It is disgusting. I have maintained the server for years, I have maintained the forums, and now you jump in and make random people enpowered over my work without my consent. If you will after years treat all your co-workers in this project like that, then good riddance Bjorn.

It is amazing that despite of hours speaking with me and alot o people trying to explain you, you can't see any wrongdoing.

And I think I should remove these people privileges anyway, untill ElvenProgrammer - the person who is this project owner, and who made me the server admin and content manager will tell otherwise

And what you are calling "insults" was in almost exact quote: "peavey, you have abused you shouldn't have got in the first time by making a character killable, please stay away from community development". My way of expressing my true feelings hadn't changed even a little during past three years, and suddenly I do insult people...this project has turned into Stalin's Russia? When one day you are perfect, godlike king's favourite, and another day you are convicted criminal, enclosing in his body all the evil of this world?

Regards.

I never said I wanted power, but as has been said, sometimes bugs can only be found on the official server (for whatever reason; I blame eAthena).

The only bugs that can be found on eathena server, can be only found locally, using eg. GDB. And that were your changes - your, Crush's, peavey's and fate's who made eathena crash every hour, when I was making changes in the content I was testing them decently and there were no problems with eathena stability.

You are skilled programmers, write a program that will run bots on test server, I was doing so using expect, autoclicker and 20 clients, you know C/C++ - you have alot more possibilities to do so than I do. I can even provide you a TMW bot.

Even Bjorn agreed, you don't need server admin rights [to test stuff], your last excuse is gone.

Regards.

Platyna wrote:Even Bjorn agreed, you don't need server admin rights [to test stuff], your last excuse is gone.

"Need" is not the same as "it comes in handy sometimes".