Comeback of the Terranite Head?

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HoraK-FDF
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Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by HoraK-FDF »

Recently I saw a Terranite Head (id 5209) on a player but after viewing the source and asking people it came to the point that that item cannot obtained atm. But that so a great item and also looks good so there is my question can you please re enable it? It could be simply a rare/ultra rare drop from Terranites witch would make a perfectly sense since its description is: "The severed head of a Terranite."

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by SpeedDuck »

It is obtainable from GM events, like other rare hats.

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by HoraK-FDF »

when are such GM events?

It would really be better if it can be a droped so that everyone can get it with hard grinding without the need of waiting for and participate in a event. 0.02% chance to drop or something like that.

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by jesusalva »

HoraK-FDF wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 17:28

when are such GM events?

When GMs decide it is a good time to do so. For items very rare like that one, it is likely to have days of advanced warning, and tend to happen every 2~3 YEARS.

(For the record, Terranite Head is rarer than Eyepatch.)

HoraK-FDF wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 17:28

It would really be better if it can be a droped so that everyone can get it with hard grinding without the need of waiting for and participate in a event. 0.02% chance to drop or something like that.

That is a huge amount.


TL;DR Some items were designed to be extremely rare and valuable.
This means only a controlled amount of items are brought in existence by GM Team. (And seldomly, DEVs or ADMins)

The reason is simple; It would make little sense to farm money and trade with other players if such items did not exist. :P

Still, some items tend to "die" with inactive players, and sometimes no one remembers they exist or no one active has one. That usually plays an important role in event scheduling.

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by Livio »

HoraK-FDF wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 17:28

when are such GM events?

Keep yourself updated with the latest TMW Forum entries and keep an eye for general chat broadcasts. You can always go around and ask someone in game.

HoraK-FDF wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 17:28

It would really be better if it can be a droped so that everyone can get it with hard grinding without the need of waiting for and participate in a event. 0.02% chance to drop or something like that.

What's the point of wasting time and money on a multiplayer online game if you grind alone all the time? Events are special since prizes and battles are very different from mainstream game and puts every player on a usually unexpected challenge.

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by HoraK-FDF »

jesusalva wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 20:17

When GMs decide it is a good time to do so. For items very rare like that one, it is likely to have days of advanced warning, and tend to happen every 23 YEARS.

2-3 years looking for and hoping that such an event may occur and then be so lucky to reach place 1 (if it is such an event and then only high players will have the best chance lower ones will go empty handed) is just too hard then even an 0.001% drop chance is better than that.

jesusalva wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 20:17

(For the record, Terranite Head is rarer than Eyepatch.)

The item is not so much better than others and its only so rare because it was made that rare. Better Items can also farmed from Illia and bossy swamp why for example is a banshee bow not that rare too? It gives way more than that little hat.

jesusalva wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 20:17

TL;DR Some items were designed to be extremely rare and valuable.
This means only a controlled amount of items are brought in existence by GM Team. (And seldomly, DEVs or ADMins)

The reason is simple; It would make little sense to farm money and trade with other players if such items did not exist. :P

But actually it is like that this items does not exist even most higher ups ran around with cat ears and what amount of GP someone will need to get such an rare item 100.000.000 GP (when I see people bet 20.000.000 for an Enchanter's Amulet witch can be get quite easily for high players)? I mean its a game if I wanted another round capitalism I should have stayed in the real world.

jesusalva wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 20:17

Still, some items tend to "die" with inactive players, and sometimes no one remembers they exist or no one active has one. That usually plays an important role in event scheduling.

Its nearly died out like it feels. Please give new players a chance to get one too somehow and I mean also for noobs with not an gozu equipment.

Livio wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 20:21

What's the point of wasting time and money on a multiplayer online game if you grind alone all the time? Events are special since prizes and battles are very different from mainstream game and puts every player on a usually unexpected challenge.

Everyone hunts alone some time and then there are times when we play together and there are not many players around anymore so one is often forced to play alone and some people even enjoy grinding. Look how often we met in the Terranite cave where you also where alone on your hunting trip ;)

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by Livio »

HoraK-FDF wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 21:42

[...] I mean its a game if I wanted another round capitalism I should have stayed in the real world.

Your real life is a "game" too: you will never be rich as filth to go around with a damn expensive sport car with a damn sexy blonde ready to satisfy whatever you have in your mind. Rare items readily available aren't rares at all.
There's no real capitalism from Admins and GMs since they earn nothing by hearing another player complaining that game is hard. Real capitalism is from players acting like traders buying and selling stuff with or without the bots and rares are hard to get even to them.

I see no point into complaining to get an item that's not so helpful in battle that people used that just a couple of time and then left it in the storage.

HoraK-FDF wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 21:42

Everyone hunts alone some time and then there are times when we play together and there are not many players around anymore so one is often forced to play alone and some people even enjoy grinding. Look how often we met in the Terranite cave where you also where alone on your hunting trip ;)

Yeah but your statement doesn't make a point: I had to go there alone since exp ratio and item farming is quite troublesome with someone giving me a hand there so I've refused help from a friend to grind together there (sorry Pingo).
I want to reach level 100 before going idle again or continue contributing to game developing. I'm a member of the only guild left in TMW Legacy and I have another mean of communicating with my guild mates: if someone is asking for help or to go play elsewhere I can give up grinding and do something else with other players.
While I'm grinding exp I'm donating keys to my guild since I have no use for those anymore. Those keys will go help guild mates into questing, having fun with Cindy mules or other kind of guild related activities that are not solo grinding crap. As for non-guild members you can ask GMs to broadcast to invite other players joining you, connect to freenode.net#themanaworld IRC channel or use centralized chat provided by Liviobot/Le Chat bots that allows you to invite someone to your chat without the need of a GM or a guild. There is Discord crap and other things as well...

If you are not happy with this game, I can understand it, I gave up playing TMW in 2014 and resumed in 2018...
You come here to ask if it's possible to lessen the rarity of that item, you got a negative response and then you came here complaining about game reflecting "real life Chocolate Cupcake capitalism"...
As I told you before you are enabled to run your own server with your own community and rules. That's a hard task but you can play TMW2:ML instead (obtaining rares there is usually matter of efforts than luck as in TMW Legacy) or simply stop playing at all because this game is something not suitable for your tastes.
Their home, their rules.

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by WildX »

An item that is part of a set and isn't just a random cosmetic-only hat shouldn't be restricted to GM events on purpose. This one is pretty easy to make droppable and might encourage people to go out and hunt some terranites too. I'm not against adding it with a >0.5% drop rate unless any other devs have an objection.

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by jesusalva »

WildX wrote: 05 Dec 2020, 18:30

An item that is part of a set and isn't just a random cosmetic-only hat shouldn't be restricted to GM events on purpose. This one is pretty easy to make droppable and might encourage people to go out and hunt some terranites too. I'm not against adding it with a >0.5% drop rate unless any other devs have an objection.

I object, I want to hear the whole GM Team on this first.

For sake of record, here is the item history.

  • Authored by cookie monster in 2016.

  • Opposition because Goblin Mask and Terranite Helmet already existed

  • Commited by gumi in march 2018 (commit message was meaningless)

  • First featured in Corsair Celebration Day 2018 (march), won by Untamed Monkey (CRC Event)

  • Featured again in GM Christmas 2018

  • Appeared in January 2019, on Hunt The Hungry Fluffies III (CRC Event)

  • re-featured in September 2019, on Slime Hunt (CRC Event)

  • re-featured on GM Halloween 2019, after Revival Candor

  • re-featured in September 2020, on Hunt The Hungry Fluffies V (CRC Event)

In general, this item seems to have been created to be a drop, then rejected in favor of terranite helmet (which is much more expensive and much weaker), then added by gumi (perhaps to be used in CRC events, I'll never know as commit message was totally unhelpful).

I would like to hear the whole GM Team on this matter.
Gumi's and CRC's input is also appreciated.

Be noted my objection ceases to be material after GM Team (all three GMs, no exceptions) manifest they are favorable. Objection also ceases if Prsm, Gumi and CRC manifest favorable as they are the directly involved parties.

And personally, I would rather swap the Mask and the Head around, or severely nerf the head to cosmetic stats.

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by WildX »

So... no head?

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by Rill »

jesusalva wrote: 05 Dec 2020, 18:52

In general, this item seems to have been created to be a drop, then rejected in favor of terranite helmet (which is much more expensive and much weaker), then added by gumi to be used in CRC events.

Just to clarify, no item has ever been added to the game to be used specifically for CRC hosted events. The items CRC has received from TMWT that have been used as prizes at public events were provided by TMWT as a courtesy.

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by Ledmitz »

I often think drops make little sense. I agree that items like this should be a rare drop, but maximum rare as in 0.01% / 1 in 10,000. Often the drops of mobs don't match well with what the mobs are. It would be cool if evil and spiky mushrooms dropped their corresponding hats. It bothers me that skellies drop fleshy parts now. It's good to obtain items, but made no actual sense. I've been playing for years and have only gotten a clover twice. If mobs had drops that rare, they'd be far harder to get. Grind for a Captain's Hat someday if you think there would be too many. ;-)

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by Hello=) »

0) Disclaimer: the following view is NOT a view of GM team, TMWT or something, it's just my private opinion.

I'd say...
1) I don't like completely unobtainable items, its waste of art and annoys players. However...
2) Many RPGs have tradition to honor players who has been there with them and took part in certain events. At the end of day it encourages people to take part in events - you can get uncommon rewards, etc. Events could very well be unique - and boast more or less unique rewards. Some "scripted" events/quests also been unique. Part of them eventually reused/extended/replayed. However, if you missed e.g. saving Jande, well, you can't easily see this part again. And, in the end, lore would generally remember only few certain heroes who did it for 1st time.
3) In RL it also happens like this: be in right place at right time - and get some unique artifact, huge discount or so. Miss that, and you'll never get second chance. But still many other things to try. Look, I can't buy some items I like - just because they're not manufactured anymore.
4) I'd say dropping ultra rare artifact by mere stupid terranite would be kinda silly.
5) This said, GMs do not generally create items on their own at random. Guess it takes quite a consensus across GM team and TMW team to do that. Which obviously raises bar, that's for sure. And so it could be rare/hard to assemble kind of thing.

Additionaly, it's more or less "badge" kind of item, not anyhow mandatory to conduct normal gameplay, do quests, etc. However if it's part of set I'd say making it somehow obtainable makes some point.

So I have an idea. How about making it a (very hard) quest? It also preferrably to feature hard boss fight, etc - with something like maybe "terranite king" or so, that maybe only appears sometimes, and takes a reasonable team to dispatch. This way it would be more defined than if/when GMs/TMWT manage to agree event, yet still big challenge that supports MMO part of game. Basically, some "relatively rare" raid can be an event on its own - taking no approval beyond meeting quest start requirement. Maybe it can (re)use Xakelbael-like mechanics to determine a winner, etc.

p.s. these are just views and ideas and there is one big nasty catch: it assumes someone could/would script that, assemble epic boss, etc :D. And ofc winning that have to be quite an achievement. Otherwise game would get swamped with this kind of thing. This said I dont really like TMW approach like "relatively easy boss, but very low drop rate". Guess "epic almost impossible boss, high drop rate" is more fun.

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by Cyrus the Great »

HoraK-FDF wrote: 03 Dec 2020, 06:38

Recently I saw a Terranite Head (id 5209) on a player but after viewing the source and asking people it came to the point that that item cannot obtained atm. But that so a great item and also looks good so there is my question can you please re enable it? It could be simply a rare/ultra rare drop from Terranites witch would make a perfectly sense since its description is: "The severed head of a Terranite."

I completely agree with what you say. In the old days, we used to have cool hats and masks that were part of events. If you participated, you had a nice looking hat that others didn't. If you missed the event, well, you were still fine.

I don't know when exactly it started to change, but now we are seeing unobtainable OP items with high stats like Terranite Head, Pachua's pipe, etc are being used by some players (usually a handful of them have most of these OP rares), which puts others at a disadvantage.

Being against these practices, I criticized these policies, but I ended up taking fire from those handfuls of high-level players. Nonetheless, it is an issue with the TMW ecosystem that might make a small portion of players happy, while alienating many newcomers and other players.

To sum up, I believe every high-stat item should be obtainable by every single player, no matter how tough the quest or how small the drop rate is. Commemorative items are fine but they shouldn't be OP and put others at disadvantage.

Last edited by Cyrus the Great on 06 Dec 2020, 07:06, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Comeback of the Terranite Head?

Post by HoraK-FDF »

Maybe make it a Quest after the normal Terranite Armor quests when Terranite arrows are available, like get 80 Terranite Ore and 600 Coal and so on.

The thing with the ultra strong monster Hello=) mentioned sounds pretty nice too.

But since its not like that over powered Illia items making it a regular drop is not game breaking I think it would not ruin anything if anyone can get it that way, it's like it doesn't ruined the game that everyone can have a banshee bow or lazuli robe at some point (or did it?).

Or maybe a chest down there in the Terranite Cave witch requires 500-1000 keys would be a good solution?

How about making a poll in Players Talk and see what all People think?


Livio wrote: 05 Dec 2020, 06:12

Your real life is a "game" too: you will never be rich as filth to go around with a damn expensive sport car with a damn sexy blonde ready to satisfy whatever you have in your mind. Rare items readily available aren't rares at all.
There's no real capitalism from Admins and GMs since they earn nothing by hearing another player complaining that game is hard. Real capitalism is from players acting like traders buying and selling stuff with or without the bots and rares are hard to get even to them.

Real life is different its no game here true death and pain exist.
Its should be not readily available a quest, a hard monster, low drop rate something like that.

Livio wrote: 05 Dec 2020, 06:12

Yeah but your statement doesn't make a point: I had to go there alone since exp ratio and item farming is quite troublesome with someone giving me a hand there so I've refused help from a friend to grind together there (sorry Pingo).
I want to reach level 100 before going idle again or continue contributing to game developing. I'm a member of the only guild left in TMW Legacy and I have another mean of communicating with my guild mates: if someone is asking for help or to go play elsewhere I can give up grinding and do something else with other players.
While I'm grinding exp I'm donating keys to my guild since I have no use for those anymore. Those keys will go help guild mates into questing, having fun with Cindy mules or other kind of guild related activities that are not solo grinding crap. As for non-guild members you can ask GMs to broadcast to invite other players joining you, connect to freenode.net#themanaworld IRC channel or use centralized chat provided by Liviobot/Le Chat bots that allows you to invite someone to your chat without the need of a GM or a guild. There is Discord crap and other things as well...

No one knows why you go there for me it looked like Livio needs terranite ore to buy terranite arrows and collects keys to go to bossy swamp. You should post this as an issue when you get punished for play together. Everyone gives up grinding when other heroes call for help. But for most farming tasks one is mostly enough because two kill so fast that the cooldown until monsters respawn is too long.

Livio wrote: 05 Dec 2020, 06:12

If you are not happy with this game, I can understand it, I gave up playing TMW in 2014 and resumed in 2018...
You come here to ask if it's possible to lessen the rarity of that item, you got a negative response and then you came here complaining about game reflecting "real life Chocolate Cupcake capitalism"...
As I told you before you are enabled to run your own server with your own community and rules. That's a hard task but you can play TMW2:ML instead (obtaining rares there is usually matter of efforts than luck as in TMW Legacy) or simply stop playing at all because this game is something not suitable for your tastes.
Their home, their rules.

I'm happy with the game but I see things that aren't so great and for that item its like it does not exist it even has no wiki entry if Rill hasn't put that hat out I still did not know that it exist (ty Rill). I think every item that has a real purpose in the game (not like style items) should be obtainable even if you miss it it should be possible to lvl up another char and get it there (like the staff and hat you get from cindy) or take on a new round like it is with Illia. But being forced to trade it from someone at prices that are so astronomical and would take weeks or month to gater is just crap.

If you say "Their home, their rules." why should they have created a Feature request sub-forum and say things like join the development, contribute to the project or however then, if they don't wanted new input, new angles of view that maybe also change their way they wanted to do a bit? I don't think they are selfish people that want do it only their way If someone makes up a real point I think they are willing to at least think about it and maybe even change it if all devs agree.

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