auto-ban / censorship

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knulfine
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auto-ban / censorship

Post by knulfine » Fri Jun 12, 2009 1:13 pm

Hi devs or whoever is in charge of this:

We have some rules in the game. One of it is, not to use foul language.
I see more and more people swearing or call others names but more than talking to them doesn't happen.
but
There are children playing this, too. Don't forget that, please. Adults may deal better with that kind of players but children are often overstrained by such a behaviour. They don't think about ignoring or just going away.
Ban for botting (also a rule) yes but ban for abuse by foul language no?

If that's too much to deal with why not making auto-ban like for spamming or / and censorship for words like "motherf***r", "f**k", a**hole", and so on? A word like "beep" on that place would do and noone had to read that really foul language.
For example:
using "bad words" 2 times it's just censored.
using "bad words" a third time, a warning like "you're about to be banned if you don't stop using foul words"
using it a forth time - ban
I'd like to programm something like that but as some of you know, I'm really stupid on such things.
I don't talk about grumbling like "damn" or the shortcut "wtf" or "wth". I think you know what I mean.

What do you think about it?
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by Crush » Fri Jun 12, 2009 2:15 pm

Automatic word filters are too easy to circumvent and cause too many false positives.

Thus they are inefficient at blocking rude players and cause a lot of problems for normal players.
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by DonCBen » Fri Jun 12, 2009 2:46 pm

I remember a game for the SNES called Uniracer, (anyone else here as old as me?!).  On this game, back in the early 90's they had a filter so that you could not enter a foul word as your character's name.  It is possible, and I agree something should be done.  My son is 8, and my brother-in-law has two daughters of 7 & 9.  It's getting to where I almost don't want them to play anymore, because you never know when some n00b might start running around spouting curse words all over the map.  I've seen it more than once. (see my post in courthouse about character named ........GS.........  I know it would be difficult, but could we at least give it a shot?  For the sake of the kids? I think this game you guys have put together is absolutely fantastic, and I would hate to have to take it away from the children in my family over some of the players' stupidity.
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by Jaxad0127 » Fri Jun 12, 2009 3:22 pm

DonCBen wrote:I remember a game for the SNES called Uniracer, (anyone else here as old as me?!).  On this game, back in the early 90's they had a filter so that you could not enter a foul word as your character's name.  It is possible, and I agree something should be done.  My son is 8, and my brother-in-law has two daughters of 7 & 9.  It's getting to where I almost don't want them to play anymore, because you never know when some n00b might start running around spouting curse words all over the map.  I've seen it more than once. (see my post in courthouse about character named ........GS.........  I know it would be difficult, but could we at least give it a shot?  For the sake of the kids? I think this game you guys have put together is absolutely fantastic, and I would hate to have to take it away from the children in my family over some of the players' stupidity.
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by Habari » Fri Jun 12, 2009 3:29 pm

i remember an old Nintendo game called mega man , it had a bad word filter ,
each time i tried to write "hello" to someone it would appear as "****o" ,
because the game thought that "hell" should be banned , even if it wasn't even
an independent word but part of hello , of course this was made by an incompetent programmer , but it is a nice story that illustrates why filters are a bad idea.
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by Crush » Fri Jun 12, 2009 3:51 pm

I am not a father yet, but I won't let my kids participate in any kind of public internet communication until they have a mental age of at least 12 or so. There are just too many perverts, sickos and fuckwards on the net and there is no reliable way to keep them out of any community, even those which are explicitely labled as child-friendly.

I wouldn't allow my little kids to use the internet at all without my supervision, because I know how much sick stuff there is on the web, how easy it is to find it and how useless filter programs are. And I won't cry for censorship either, because 1) I believe that it is the job of the parents to control and filter the media consumption of their children and 2) internet censorship just doesn't work.

The internet is a great toy, but it is not a toy for children.
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by knulfine » Fri Jun 12, 2009 4:03 pm

But can't there really not be done more than just talking to the one? Maybe in the GM-section of the forum (dunno if you have it here) you could make a list of people who where reported because of such behaviour so you could have an eye on them and maybe ban them after a few times... I mean, at least it's a rule. And we all know talking doesn't mean a thing to those people... They say yes and sorry and then go round the corner and start it again...

I have already two people on my ignore list, that's not the problem. I leave or ignore but I don't wanna have a list of... dunno 20 people within 2 month, just because noone watches that this important rule is taken seriously.
There are times you sit in Hurnscald and you can't have a normal conversation 'cause some dumb... person is too stupid to follow the rules... And when you tell a gm they come and talk... oh great. Then the gm leaves and it starts again. I witnessed that...
Sometimes it's maybe a problem with the language but there are enough bilingual players who can translate...
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by Jumpy » Fri Jun 12, 2009 5:11 pm

Hi

i posted already several things, thoughts
i made up some idea about that matter and invite everyone debating

1- Yes it is inaceptable to see some people acting this way "Insulting" - "Provocking" - "saying bad words",...
1.1- first and third are inaceptable
1.2- is part of the game

2- Yes some solution (automatic ban and so on exist but
2.1- it can be easy to say it with other characters and-or write them in a way the autoban can't recognise them
2.2- autoban is never a good solution
regarding freedom of expression
regarding the poor people who would say "don't say this word!!!" answer would be " what word???" and ... poor nice player banned for repeating the word... too bad
2.3- GM would spend there time trying to talk to everyone so that a kind of good feeling reign in tmw...
2.4- it becomes a competition

not a solution really

3- who are those persons?
3.1- kids trying acting as kids: i learn a bad word ... what do i do as a kid :) find a place to repeat it... and if it is against some rules :) better... ahhhhhh children...
3.2- kids with no references in their education about that concern... not my problem i am not their father... don't try to say anything if oyu don't won't to have a report made on abuse court by the father :D humm trying to be serious... when it is not the kid that says don't insult my mother... ahhh children...
3.3- dev testing (or not testing) how far the game goes in terms of reaction of people... never forget tmw is just a hudge test... BUT ! Devs are 99 % the people that have the best behavings in tmw ! ! don't doubt on this ! ! in a certain way, we are all devs and testers in the matter of behaving, attitude and so on so give the example to others
3.4- sometime a bad word can escape from anyone... don't throw a stone... you know the rest ;)

4- (i am a father, my daughter is 8 and plays from time to time with my char) it is parents responsability-duty to chose wether or not to let their children play a game or not if they are responsable of their acts as parents.

well and some more things...

gtg to drink aperitif with my neighbours :) see you later :)

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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by DonCBen » Fri Jun 12, 2009 5:54 pm

[/quote]
(see attachment)[/quote]

Younger kids are not usually going to see the letters, just the characters. Their minds are very literal at that age. And don't anybody try to insult my kids because of this statement. They are both very intelligent young people.
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by Jaxad0127 » Fri Jun 12, 2009 6:06 pm

DonCBen wrote:Younger kids are not usually going to see the letters, just the characters. Their minds are very literal at that age. And don't anybody try to insult my kids because of this statement. They are both very intelligent young people.
You forget that 1337 is popular among the younger generation(s).
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by John P » Fri Jun 12, 2009 6:08 pm

I completely agree with Don.

There is no reason not to start with a minor censor script to block the common usage of more severe words (disregarding the work-arounds). As more variations occur, more can be added, or not. When you use one of the words, the script could even send you a private message "swearing in TMW is strictly prohibited and can lead to your account being disabled. Please refer to whatever rules".

While it won't stop everyone, it will act as at least a short wall. Something is better than nothing, and I know it is a pretty easy thing to do.

Haven't you heard the story of the guy throwing starfish back into the sea?
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by kr0n05931 » Fri Jun 12, 2009 6:16 pm

People, you're being hypocrites here.

"OMG, MY CHILD JUST SAW THE WORD DICK, OMG, HE MIGHT GO KILL SOMEONE OR COMMIT A HORRIBLE ACT NOW!"

Remember that your children are also KILLING INNOCENT ANIMALS AND KILLING OTHER PEOPLE IN THE GAME WITH DANGEROUS WEAPONS, AND WEAPONS THAT STILL EXIST, SUCH AS SWORDS, and yet you complain about THIS?!?!



Seriously, teach your kid what the word means, tell him not to use it, and BAM! You're done. I hate lazy parents.


Parents playing this videogame instead of parenting your children like you're supposed to, please leave. We're much better off without the stupid censorship attitude. Remember that our soldiers fight everyday so that you may keep the freedoms we hold so dear, such as the freedom of speech, yet you try and steal it away behind their backs with bullshit like this. If you want censorship, move to fucking China.

The world is a rough, barren place, and the sooner you teach your children that, the better off they'll be.
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by Jumpy » Fri Jun 12, 2009 6:36 pm

hey :)

well very strong way to say things
i agree on part of it
but

Tmw can also be a great way to be with your kids and teach them some things, values - principles and so, on so much better bases than in front of a tv ;) at least there is a dialog here ;)

i know entire familly playing here in tmw and they are all doing great :) separated by kilometers it is also a way to be in family around a game as we use to do when ... we were young :) on sunday, with cards or society game as Monopoly, risk and so on :) do you remmeber ? game evolve, society evolve, everything evolve. It is just transformation, a mutation of game. that 's one strenght of this kind of game
it is not a game you against the others mobs and npc. there is something behind: comunity etc etc

of course i am not saying it is THE way to educate or whatever but it is one within several different ways to realize some education and legacy. bla bla bla and so on etc... i am sure you know what i am saying and talking about ;)

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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by kr0n05931 » Fri Jun 12, 2009 6:50 pm

Jumpy wrote: Tmw can also be a great way to be with your kids and teach them some things, values - principles and so, on so much better bases than in front of a tv ;) at least there is a dialog here
That sounds a lot like how in the book, 1984, they used school as a vehicle to move propaganda around.


I don't want TMW to become Big Brother's propaganda-spreader.


I like socialism, I am pro-evolution, and I am a Christian, but you don't see me trying to use my pixel art in TMW as a vehicle to spread ideals.
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Re: auto-ban / censorship

Post by Jumpy » Fri Jun 12, 2009 7:04 pm

erf

seems we missunderstood...

i was saying it is a way that can be use as any other game to give to your children some messages...

that's all

i am NOT saying you or any dev or admin or whoever in teams are here to push advertising or any political issues...

Regards

and hope i am clear !
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