REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

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Inkweaver
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Inkweaver » Mon Jul 13, 2009 3:27 am

Sounds good.

I need help finding the guidelines on how to write the code for an item or a quest.

How can I make the other things required to make this idea a feature?
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Enchilado! » Mon Jul 13, 2009 5:03 am

Sounding worse by every post, I'm afraid. It seems to be changing slowly so that basically you can be a white mage whom everybody loves, or you can be a dark mage, who isn't any more powerful but whom everybody hates.
I would recommend each side to have pros and cons, which are roughly opposite.

White Magi
Healing magic - so they don't die so fast.
Nature magic - ability to change the weather and get help from plants in their battles.
Evil Draining magic - this draws the power of evil from your enemies. Against creatures such as Skulls and Jack O it is devastating, against Scorpions and aggressive Snakes and Spiders it is powerful, it is good against Mushrooms and Cave Snakes, it barely hurts Logheads and Maggots and it doesn't affect Fluffies, Mouboo, Squirrels etc.
Astral magic - summoning, teleporting.
Transmutation magic

Black Magi
Nature draining magic - this draws the life from good creatures of Nature, and, into the bargain, you get some of the hp you take off. However, as the most powerful monsters in the game are evil, it won't be that good. In reverse to the Evil Draining Magic, it is most powerful against Mouboo and Squirrels and Fluffies, and less against Logheads and Maggots and so on, and so on.
Death magic - this is equally good against all creatures, and is very powerful but very expensive. However, it still isn't as good against Jack O and Skulls as the Evil Draining magic of the White Magi is.
Necromancy - while this magical attack is on, creatures you kill will come back to life after a certain amount of seconds - depending on your magic level - and attack things in the same was as summoned creatures. However, they are only 1/2 as powerful as the living kind and have just 1 hp. Although monsters won't attack them, other players can.
Astral magic - teleporting only
Transmutation magic

Or, rather than having a Magic skill, players have both White Magic and a Black Magic.

PvP could be enabled between White and Black magi in all areas.

~remember that I wrote this very quickly,
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Kill3rZ » Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:09 am

OK, Enchillado, sounds good. However, I think that, at the moment, the white magic would be a little too good. Without some really strong *good* creatures that are aggressive to black characters (I think you should be able to be evil as a warrior/archer too), the evil path is a draw-back, just like it is now.

White mages would have all the fun, slaying hundreds of strong evil creatures (we already have those and they drop most of the good stuff) with their cool anti-darkness spells, being able to heal every single scratch they get in a split second, while dark ones only get to depopulate forests. Even if all mouboos and squirrels and mushrooms and fluffies and pinkies would go berserk in the presence of a dark mage, you still wouldn't get the thrill (or the benefits) of hunting skulls, snakes, spiders or jack-o.

Even if we don't add an evil Sagatha who rejects the evil mages if they kill the wrong stuff, they are still crippled when they get to hunt non-aggressive snakes/spiders/skulls/etc. as their (expensive) killing spell is not that efficient against evil creatures.

And I'm still not pleased with the idea that a black mage cannot heal. As I said, there is no reason why we couldn't have evil healing. I'm afraid that the nature draining spell is not good enough. I'm talking about gameplay here. The dark mages crippled over and over again by all the disadvantages (too expensive spells - we already have them. Guess what! They almost never get used - lower power against all the evil strong monsters) will also need to flee from lots of battles and find some quiet place where they can eat some carrots to regain hp. It sucks to be a dark mage. It should go without saying that motivation for becoming evil is trading your soul for POWER! Dark mages are not maniacs, but corrupted souls. How can you get corrupted by something that just isn't tempting? White and dark should be equal in advantages and disadvantages. Healing, if you really feel that evil cannot get it could only be balanced by extremely strong resistance.
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Kill3rZ » Mon Jul 13, 2009 8:34 am

Well, I gave it another thought and evil draining spell is a bad idea. Philosophically, darkness is just a name we found for the lack of light. "Bad" is the name for the lack of "good". To put it this way, if I don't have any money in my pockets and therefore I'm poor, you don't just get to "drain" my lack of money.

If you don't like my mirror idea (a similar "evil" spell for each "good" one), this is how I think it should work:
1. If a white mage "heals" or "blesses" a jack-o/skull/undead/etc. this should damage/poison it.
2. For any other creatures, white mages should only have natural, element-based war spells. This way, you have to adapt your attack spell for each type of monster you encounter: fire-based monsters will be vulnerable to water, water-based will be hurt by lightning, lightning by earth, earth by fire)
3. All pure-killing, life-draining spells will only be available to dark mages. The killing spells should be weaker on evil monsters, but no weaker than the "destructive healing".
4. I insist that black mages should have at least one evil (weaker/high-level requiring) healing spell - I suggest a vampire spell, or else, they should have good, cheap armor spells and the evil monsters should have lower attack/damage on black mages.

Your necromancy idea is great and it's perfect for replacing summons.

I think it would be interesting to have some self-transmutating spells. I'm talking about a temporary/reversible transformation.

Black mages should have a werewolf mode (adds poison to his attacks but lowers the accuracy), a leech mode (makes him more vulnerable to attacks, but regains some HP each time he hits something) and a bat mode (dramatically lowers attack and damage, but makes him harder to hit so that he has a chance to flee from battles and make a run through dangerous crowded places.)

White mages should have a bear mode (better attack and damage, but you can do no magic while you are in this mode), a turtle mode (strong defense at the cost of walking and attack speed) and chameleon mode (you become invisible when you don't move/attack/cast spells, but you have to unequip all armor and clothes)
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Kage » Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:46 pm

White Mages should also get a item or spell to balance the power, but considering that dark mages can not even get astral magic as of right now, I think they need some love.
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Inkweaver » Mon Jul 13, 2009 9:56 pm

Kage wrote:White Mages should also get a item or spell to balance the power, but considering that dark mages can not even get astral magic as of right now, I think they need some love.
Yeah, Dark Mages needs some truly evil spells or weapons, which is why I am requesting this cursed dagger.

I needs some help finding tutorials or something about how to write the code for the quest, or for the items.
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Rygan » Thu Jul 23, 2009 10:00 pm

I'm not too keen on the idea of a black/white mages. It assumes that one can only be pure good or pure evil, not just a chaotic or gray/neutral mage.


Also, with this quest that would make a mage into a dark mage, would they would still have their skill level in the other schools of magic. So, one could level up as a "white mage" and then, decide to move over to the dark side, being an extremely powerful mage.

I don't think this is particularly practical, and would unbalance the game. This really should be abandoned.
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Jaxad0127 » Thu Jul 23, 2009 10:02 pm

Rygan wrote:I'm not too keen on the idea of a black/white mages. It assumes that one can only be pure good or pure evil, not just a chaotic or gray/neutral mage.


Also, with this quest that would make a mage into a dark mage, would they would still have their skill level in the other schools of magic. So, one could level up as a "white mage" and then, decide to move over to the dark side, being an extremely powerful mage.

I don't think this is particularly practical, and would unbalance the game. This really should be abandoned.
We'll likely have shades of gray. Black and white is too unrealistic.
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Kill3rZ » Fri Jul 24, 2009 12:44 pm

Well, the decision has to be made pretty early in the game (while learning the first levels of magic) and some people already made it toward darkness (breaking the druid tree branch and/or killing the mouboo) even though at the moment it only brought trouble to them - lack of astral magic, permanent ban from Sagatha and Wyara and nothing at all to balance this damage.

Choosing to heal the tree and the mouboo should mark you as a "good/white" mage for the rest of the game with no way to cross over later on - just like the fact that there is no way to seek and receive forgiveness for the "unforgivable mistakes".

The "dark Sagatha" will obviously never forgive you for healing that cursed tree/mouboo that (s)he wanted dead.

The black/white idea could still be kept if that was the only reason for rejecting it.

We can even add a shade of grey as some people healed the mouboo and injured the tree or the other way around. We can have a separate "chaos school" and/or we can have both Sagatha and the"dark Sagatha" teach them some stuff, so they will have more spells, but not "the good stuff" as they will have performed some of their tasks, but failed to prove allegiance to any party. Both trainers will give them some tasks, and they will be some sort of double agents, working for both parties and being trusted by none. This is where a thief class might fit in.
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Fern » Fri Jul 24, 2009 4:05 pm

Why don't make some spells depend on the "good/bad karma points".

So.. if someone chooses the dark path (negative karma) and later changes to the good path (positive karma) the dark spells won't be as powerful as they were before (the positive karma makes the dark spells be weaker). On the other side... the more positive your karma is, the purer your soul and the more powerful your white magic is. The same for evil.. the more evil the more destruction you can make with your black magic spells.

The grey characters could seek for a balance between black magic and white magic.

I wouldn't like that this decision was to be taken and unchanged for the rest of the game... I'll prefer for this to be a variable that can change dynamically and that people have to try seeking the balance, so that if you make a mistake you can try to pay for your sins doing good actions (or the opposite).

BTW, what's the problem with black magic being destruction/annoyance and white magic being healing/aid?
I think that evil is supposed to be offensive magic, and you know, sometimes a good attack is the best defense. Healing is not that needed for a dark mage, you can buy potions with the money you get from massive destruction, just like you would have done before magic appeared. There are a lot of RPGs where only the priest has the ability to heal and nobody complains.
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by christopher1 » Sun Jan 31, 2010 1:25 am

Kage wrote:How about this instead, what if the cursed dagger lowered your vit by say... 50?

This will decrease both your HP and armor a great deal.
I could say that dagger is the most powerful weapon for me.
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Anonymous!!! » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:56 am

Inkweaver wrote: Good idea. This is essential so that a white magician can't just start an evil character and then transfer the weapon over to himself to avoid loosing nature and healing magic.
Why not make it so that if a light magician touches a dark magic item they die?
And dark touches a light item and they die...

Maybe not only die but loose all magic, level down to one again and have horrible things happen to them...
It would be evil but would show you that you can't use the enemy's compass. :wink:

Possibly as a neutral magician the items have no extraordinary effects...

but as a neutral magician casting both dark and light spells is the advantage...

maybe have items such as this a disadvantage to neutrals.
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Re: REQ Cursed Dagger Weapon

Post by Anonymous!!! » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:59 am

Fern wrote:Why don't make some spells depend on the "good/bad karma points".

So.. if someone chooses the dark path (negative karma) and later changes to the good path...
I think changing to the opposite side shouldn't be allowed...

maybe an NPC can allow you to turn neutral but it is permanent neutrality.

Nor light or dark spells are quite as strong...
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