The World of Mana

Ashril · Post by **Ashril** » 30 Sep 2005, 19:14

The World of Mana is an the fourth game in the series Seiken Densetsu (most commonly known in North America by the second in the series: Secret of Mana for the SNES). It is being developed, like the others in the series, by Square-Enix. The reason I bring this up is because your game has a similar name (I plan on downloading it in the next couple of days!) and I would hate to see a project like this get shut down or hit with some kind of lawsuit due to similiar "product" names.

I first read about it here:
http://ps2.ign.com/articles/651/651671p1.html [ign.com]

Will this game affect you guys in any way?

Post by **ElvenProgrammer** » 30 Sep 2005, 19:24

We already know about it. You ask if this game will affect us? I don't think so, but who knows?

Post by **Crush** » 30 Sep 2005, 20:43

i would be careful. "the mana world" and "the world of mana" sound very similar and could even be very similar products. it is very likely that it will be an online rpg, too. so there is a high risc of confusion.

i am not a lawyer, but we used the name before, so we might win a lawsuit. but "mana" itself could be a long ago registred trademark by square. when that's the case we will lose for sure. anyone know where to check that?

Edit: i did a little research at the united states patent and trademark office:
http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/gate.exe?f=l ... h&p_d=trmk

seems as if square didn't register the trademark "mana" itself, but they registered "secret of mana", "legend of mana", "sword of mana" and "the world of mana".

maybe we should think about a namechange.

Post by **Matt** » 30 Sep 2005, 21:01

Well we had already a thread about it. And i think we used the name first.

xand · Post by **xand** » 30 Sep 2005, 23:41

Sure that's true, but if they registered "The world of mana"
it doesn't matter if we used it before. Maybe they just registered
it earlier

Al least there _is_ a chance that they could try to get the name
and risk a lawsuite. (Concerning money they got better cards)
You never know what companies do if they see a chance and
only the big money behind something...

EDIT:
Ah, ok seems as if "The world of Mana" got registered April 27, 2005.
I'm no lawyer but it seems to me that only if you register a trademark,
you really own it...

Post by **Matt** » 01 Oct 2005, 10:10

Well and we had already our first birthday... and we are just fans of the great Secret of Mana. So who cares...

Dayne · Post by **Dayne** » 01 Oct 2005, 12:46

degen · Post by **degen** » 01 Oct 2005, 12:48

Hmm adn yes if Square is so stupid as to think alall publicity is good publicity getting in news for suing trademark with a bunch of nobodies is worth it jsut to get peopel to talk about TWoM ...
Maybe thye find a long garranted law suit to be worth it ...
I hope they do have a heart ...
But still considering a name change might not be bad ...
Since they can afford drawing it out in court.
We cant ...
Which would probably end it with tmw loosing the case...

Well maybe i have seen to many movies or such but keeping it in mind or atelast taking contact with Square and their policy support or something might not be a bad idea, or starting to reconsider a new name for the game.

Post by **Rotonen** » 01 Oct 2005, 13:03

As I said back in April, I think it would benefit us if we took the initiative here. (Assuming they will come after us because of our name.) An email to Square/Enix wouldn't really hurt in that case.

On the other hand that could blow our low profile cover and trigger them to come after us.

I have no legal training, but that's my opinion. At least I would appreciate if someone would come to negotiate with me about this kind of a misfortunate event instead of me having to notice myself and take legal action against the "ignorant fools who are stealing my trademark".

Post by **Pajarico** » 01 Oct 2005, 13:42

Just to let you know: you can't register a word as "mana"

Post by **Crush** » 01 Oct 2005, 14:17

you are wrong. the word "mana" is a registred trademark for many different products. it is a registred trademark for a record label, a cloth company (who explicitely states in the trademark description that it is "not for promotion of musical groups" to not colide with the record label), an education program, sports drinks and many others.

(you only register a trademark for one kind of product. when i register mana as a trademark for my toothbrush you can still name your car or coffee machine mana. but you are not allowed to use the name for a product similar to a toothbrush).

Post by **Pajarico** » 01 Oct 2005, 14:36

you are wrong. the word "mana" is a registred trademark for many different products. it is a registred trademark for a record label, a cloth company (who explicitely states in the trademark description that it is "not for promotion of musical groups" to not colide with the record label), an education program, sports drinks and many others.

Then you are proving me right.

You can't register a word of common use that is not an invention (as example "blu ray" is trademarked, but you can't trademark "blue ray" or "blue" or "ray").
In every example you put is attached to a very precise product, whereas what i wanted to say is that you can't just register "mana" and sue everyone who uses it, but in the other hand you can sue someone who uses mana for a clothes line. Two differents things

In brief: you can't trademark the word "Crush" and ask for a fee for everyone who uses it. But is possible to merchandise a drink called "Crush" and sue someone who uses it for selling another drink.

On another note, i don't know what are your sources for claiming that, not that i don't trust you; but many times trademarks cover a whole "package": logos, words, mottos, designs, etc... and not only a word attached to precise product.

Verious · Post by **Verious** » 01 Oct 2005, 15:33

An individual dictionary word cannot be trademarked. Therefore, there is no risk of using the word "Mana".

Additionally, "The Mana World" is not the same as "The World of Mana". They could easily be interpreted to have very different meanings.

Post by **Talaroc** » 01 Oct 2005, 19:58

I would definately send an email to them.

Sure, it may "blow our cover," but that's going to happen sooner or later, and it'd be better for us to be considering a name change now in pre-alpha, rather than down the line after 1.0 when Square notices and sends a "Cease and Desist" letter.

People seem to be thinking that Square is a buddy of theirs. This is a huge corporation we're talking about here; they don't care if we liked their games. If they think our project will impact their sales (ie, people searching for TWoM find TMW instead and don't go for TWoM), they can will drop a legal hammer on us. Software companies and the like have no reservations about suing the operators of fan sites, if the site includes something they think negatively impacts their business. It's all about the Benjamins, as they say.

So yeah. Send the letter (paper mail, not email). Find out what their legal team thinks. If they say we're ok to continue onward, save the response. They might change their mind later and that's a good thing to have. If they say we're not ok as-is, we need to be willing to go along with what they have to say, to avoid being shut down entirely.

Post by **Pajarico** » 01 Oct 2005, 21:28

People seem to be thinking that Square is a buddy of theirs. This is a huge corporation we're talking about here; they don't care if we liked their games.

So true

There was another game based in Mana or maybe Final Fantasy (could be about Chrono Trigger) and got forcer to shutdown their website.
I'm looking for a link but can't find it