The official server flamewar topic

[Altus Institute]

Not sure if its intentional bully tactic of misinterpretation and demonization or we need to:

Bully?
In what world did you see that when you asking something to someone its bullying someone?
What forum did you read?
not the mana world forum its seems.
See your own words

I wanted to summarize a few points about content flame wars, as a reminder for anyone who wants to complain about content in future and for myself for having a history of starting at least one and engaging in a few.

I'll start by quoting wushin: "Yes, it's open source, yes the community matters, but those making commits and changes get more voice because they are doing and fixing."
So i think before complaining we need to ask ourselves: Can we make it better? do we have the skills in art and or coding, the will and time to make it better? if the answer is yes great join #themanworld-dev on freenode and start making commits. if you lack the skills but got the will you can start by reading how to develop on our wiki.

If the answer is no, well there are other ways to get more involved:
Join the test team (if you don't know how to join ask me or the devs in a pm)
Read the messages that are sent to the test team (they include info on upcoming updates)
Visit test server and test new content
Suggest better idea's on irc channel #themanaworld and #themanaworld-dev on freenode, or here on the forums

If you still don't engage in any of the above but think you got an awesome idea, make a poll on this forum on whether to implement your idea.
If you don't have any constructive idea but still want to complain, congratulations you are a troll. go ahead and complain but don't expect us to take it seriously.

*removed*
OFC i dont make a poll about this sensitive topics or you will say i spew hate against you.
If you are not highly capable to answer a simple question without seeing war, hate...why do you answer instead who are concerned?
Are you in his head to know that he felt bully after saying ppl are good for nothing?
Seems you know better what happend in his head than yours......*removed*

*removed*

and ofc i dont wait that you can understand something since you lack of the most important thing to help you to understand a thing.
*removed*
See he cant even understand his own words without saying noboby loves him when he continue to say empty word *removed*. ok this one was easy...

[SriNitayanda]

Funny you read this sentence again and again and still don't understand it so i'll make it easier for you:
Go ahead and complain is not only people who do something can say something. (your logic is: go ahead and complain = shut up)
Yes if someone will have a constructive critic the devs are more likely to listen to him. Got any? didn't think so thats why your posts are here.

[Altus Institute]

Funny .... i'll make it easier for you:
Go ahead and complain is not only people who do something can say something. (your logic is: go ahead and complain = shut up)
Yes if someone will have a constructive critic the devs are more likely to listen to him. Got any? didn't think so thats why your posts are here.
Congratulations again:

hey seems you understand others logic when you lack to understand your own.
And like a pet you go wherever i want.
See.
i spam it for you

Go ahead and complain is not only people who do something can say something.

Now that you have said what i wanted to read, can you tell me why wushin insulting ppl as good for nothing?
As you said ppl can post and complain, but in this case its was a poll.
So someone asked the community to talk.
The community talked and was insulted.
Because they vote against to remove the boobs?
was it not a poll where ppl give their answers?
But for some undetermined reasons wushin insulted ppl in front of all over community, and you trying to turn the events as we bullyyyyyy wushin, we haaaaaate devs....

For what reason did you removed my post from Eurni poll?
did you see hate and anger in?
Lol you see nothing so just stop wearing this stupid glasses of yours who show you things as they are not.

So please stop it before you live under the ground with the the carrots and the worms, you are so much ridiculous trying to play the bravest one.
The spiritual one perhaps?
its poor, im sure that you can do better...
You make me sad you poor thing. (Im not really sad !!)

See Prsm, have understood that we cant ask to ppl to follow the rules while as gm you dont follow them.
It was not hilarious to see gm complain about offensive words while gm used offensive words?
So my post was not constructive?
its not because you lack to understand that the other dont understand.
If you start to understand, you know what you have to do, if not....

but of course you have no shame its for that you try and try again.
So please try again....
And dont forget the funny pictures....a post of yours without funny picture for simpletons is like a dinner without wine....something miss
Simpletons like funny pictures because they cant understand sentences.
Ty for helping those who cant understand.
But stop moving my post telling that they dont match with your point of view.
it cant be, you understand it well now?

*removed*
Do you saw meko spam picture before he changed for another one?
Do you saw it or you missed this historic moment?
Even your back up lack to understand their own actions.
posting twice the same spam picture, it was so hilarious, ty meko for this moment.
*removed*

[SriNitayanda]

The only way we moderate you here is keeping you to one topic. Yeah i don't mind you using offensive language against me, some people do. Still there is a difference between calling people dumbass's and me implying that you don't understand my post (notice it was always a question, i implied maybe you lack the brain, you said i have no brain).
So let me break it down for you:
The post was a reminder for me too, i didn't like the language i used at first when i opened the poll, did you read my original post? do think it was a constructive critic? do you think it helped in anyway to make the change?
The poll did help, you could've made the poll too. but instead you said that wushin is trying to brainwash you, do you think it was helpful? do you really think that was what crossed his mind?
Anyway i made my post in order to suggest for us the community a way we should engage in critic about changes and how to influence the game content. Again a suggestion, not mandatory rules.
Can you show me exactly how wushin insulted the community? By saying that they do not engage enough in getting info about updates and changes in the game? that the people who got the skills don't lift a finger to make changes?
I moved your post and i'll move all your posts to here, cause they belong here and you admit it, you do it to provoke people, i enjoy it, other people do not. did it really hurt you that wushin made a poll about a small change?
So thanks again for admitting.

[Altus Institute]

calling people dumbass's
and me implying that you don't understand my post
(notice it was always a question, i implied maybe you lack the brain, you said i have no brain).

I said i give 'dumbass' as gift to be fair, like that you can said Altus Institute used offensive words against us too. read my previous post before talking for nothing.

you implied?

so what is an answer for such a question?
And you lack to understand my answer.
now you play innocent, telling that its obvious....idc
See

[21:34] Prsm: are you stupid

Prsm implied that a player is stupid.
see its a question....always.
He didnt say : you are.
He implied that the player is one.
like that in a direct/indirect sentence, he can save his butt saying i dont say it, i asked you if .... And you said it, not me.....
But in final you use a not direct sentence to say something rude.
Telling us now that you asked me about IF ...

Lets us talk about it.
if i said yes i have, that suppose that you are an idiot.
i said no i havent, meaning yes im stupid to not implied that you are.
you see, i took care about you, and you still dont want to understand it.

so i stop it here the lesson, im not like you, implied that ppl are just stupid enough to understand only picture for simpleton or "me" language.
And turning everything up side down hoping that nobody will follow what you trying to do.

So genius what else?

The post was a reminder for me too, i didn't like the language i used at first when i opened the poll, did you read my original post? do think it was a constructive critic?

The discussion was constructive.
And because the discussion was constructive, all of this happend.
I will not tell you how to read, im not your dad or your professor.
If you dont understand ask....its simple : a question an answer.
I didnt means that i will answer you....see your reminder post about

The poll did help, you could've made the poll too. but instead you said that wushin is trying to brainwash you, do you think it was helpful? do you really think that was what crossed his mind?

No way i could do such a poll.
I already know that you dont care about community point of view.
and in your post reminder you explain it well....
So what is the point for me to make a poll?
If you care about community, the tmwc already have build a way to put ingame what community waiting for, and its not the case.
In the boobs thread i said that wushin brainwash me or is that and old discussion you talk about? Make it clear plz.

Can you show me exactly how wushin insulted the community? By saying that they do not engage enough in getting info about updates and changes in the game? that the people who got the skills don't lift a finger to make changes?

here.....

Here we have at least 15+ people who voted yes, who are highly capable doing nothing.

here sir, ofc im implied that wushin was not talking about dev community..
Perhaps im wrong
If you cant read it, its obvious that you have an issue, see some one to help you to fix it.
Plus: i wrote it in all of my post, even meko saw it as spam.
So what is the point for you to ask again?
Do you think that the answer will change?
You moved my post from Eurni poll....you should know it.

You lie, you deny.....its all you can do, see how many ppl talk about "nudity" in the new thread, see how many artists came to give their point of view about.....so if wushin dont find some artist to answer his demand, he should ask himself if community want it. Instead he want to impose his decision calling ppl good for nothing.
I already explain all of this in my previous post, can you read them, i beg you or meko will say that im spamming the forum.

If you dont understand something in what i've said i will be please to clear my way.
If you posting just about to change my point of view, you are wrong, it will not change until the guy who is concerned answer. Until then...you can continue to imply and imagine.....

I moved your post and i'll move all your posts to here, cause they belong here and you admit it, you do it to provoke people, i enjoy it, other people do not. did it really hurt you that wushin made a poll about a small change?
So thanks again for admitting.

Are you really taking ppl for dumb?
Your Boobs poll was done to provoke....
isnt it?
You didnt even read my post about wushin's small change, you just try to write your own vision of my post, you try to imagine.
Stop imagine, read it...its simple like a simpleton.


Lets talk truth, lets talk about your picture for simpletons.
Those who already understood it, can go to get a coffee.
Simpletons picture users read it, *removed*

You see all ppl enjoy their situation, nobody care about the troll.
The only one who see the troll is the photograph
That means the one who took the picture see the troll, nobody else noticed that there a troll among them.
Because every body know that a troll does not exist. Its obvious.
But because the reader stand at the photograph place.
With this picture you try to custom everyone point of view to match with yours.
By the fake you failed.
Because its obvious troll doesnt not exist, only in your eyes( your mind if you prefer).
So you need microsoft paint to express it, like if its real.
its an image patchwork, that means only you can see what you want to see because you built it.
What that means for the forum?
The same, you try to see troll where you want, even if they dont exist and even if its not true.
you try to build some troll, when you dont understand something or if something disturb you, and you disguise a user as if he is a troll.
For you a troll is a disturbance in your point of view.
But it not the case.....but seems you cant understand it.
But for simpleton its not really clear.
And they take it with fear....
And some, take picture for *removed* to express themselves, their own deep fear.
Relax, troll doesnt exist for real.
Its only your imagination and microsoft paint who built it.
If you are alone, or need a friend to talk about your issue, you can open a thread about, im pretty sure that you will find some who will take care of you.
Hope that its help you a bit

ps : next time try with a picture where ppl see the troll. ofc i will explain it for you if you ask for.

[SriNitayanda]

hey seems you understand others logic when you lack to understand your own.
And like a pet you go wherever i want.
See.
i spam it for you

Funny that you think you bring me to some point, if you actually understood the post in first place you wouldn't have the delusions you have now. like i said, go on and complain means to you don't dare to complain, great logic. (it was in the original post) ofc you omitted it from your post.
How does saying to people instead of sitting on your ass start to do something is insulting is beyond me but again, gr8 logic.
Anyway i said you can say whatever to me, but not to the other members so by calling meko stupid you ignored my warning.
So this is the second warning.
I hope next time you'll put less than four hours answering me, i am really not worth it.
I won't answer you anymore, you can keep posting on the forum, but if it will be with the same attitude i'll move it here.

[Altus Institute]

Funny that you think you bring me to some point, if you actually understood the post in first place you wouldn't have the delusions you have now. like i said, go on and complain means to you don't dare to complain, great logic. (it was in the original post) ofc you omitted it from your post.

i dont think, i did it.
And i have any of what you call delusions, idk why you said that.
Like you said?
You said everything and is contrary, it to me to congratz you about your great imagination.

How does saying to people instead of sitting on your ass start to do something is insulting is beyond me but again, gr8 logic.

of course you cant understand, if you could you never complain in the boobs pool to remove to the others the right to complain in your reminder.
So i will not explain it to you....ask your friends....ha yes they cant understand too.
you are beyond any logic : i said black is white you made me laugh a lot ty.

Anyway i said you can say whatever to me, but not to the other members so by calling meko stupid you ignored my warning.
So this is the second warning.

ah yes i wanted so much but i didnt use the word stupid.
so i dont care about your warning.
So you try to understand direct and indirect language.
SO YOU CAN CALL PPL AS YOU ARE PLEASED BUT NOT THE OTHERS???

Prsm calling ppl stupid, its normal.
wushin calling ppl good for nothing, its normal.
SriNitayanda calling ppl brainless is normal.
But that ppl insult you like you did its not normal??
you deny it, worse you trying to turn everything at your advantage.
Meko was the first calling me stupid by posting his spam picture for simpleton.
i said it in my post, you want to take it like you want, feel free
So where are you warning for these people???
what an entertainment you are....

I hope next time you'll put less than four hours answering me, i am really not worth it.
I won't answer you anymore.

yes i do my best, like if answering to sir 'i understand only what i want' was my first priority in my day...


whatever these guys have done for the game, and i dont care that you are a gm, you just spew your nonsense to every one on this forums telling that you are in charge and nothing can happens to you.
So you are in charge???
You guys want to play 'im in charge'??
you are a powerful gm in charge??
you cant even moderate your own mate, and you try to moderate others?
Do you take the hint why tmwc added some rules?
or you just want to say im in charge to say i cant say nothing else?
you seems to forget several simple things, i will help you to get them.

[prsm]

With all due respect, I used the word stupid once, and I have apologized for doing so!

[blackrazor]

To Wushin:

I noticed you've been consolidating your power, lately. o11c much?

You have removed posts of mine from the forums. More importantly, you over-rode Crush and changed the purpose of "The Server Move Flamewar Topic" into an overall garbage receptacle now meant to toss anything you don't like within.

Did the TMWC give you this wide authority? Why are you taking it? Where is Crush? He is still the Forum Admin, yes? I preferred Crush being admin to the forums over what you have done, certainly. Crush used his rightful authority to create that topic into exactly what he chose to make it, and I don't like that you've messed with his ruling within his domain of purview.

[SriNitayanda]

If you think there was a mistreatment by some members of tmwc towards you, bring it up to us, yes we all work in the same team but we are individuals. We'll consider it, if there was a mistreatment, we'll try to improve.
Consider this topic reporting tmwc for mistreatment, whether its a reasonable report or not. Got a better idea? this is the 3rd new thread with similar topic being opened in the last 3 days. I don't see where it fits more, so i am moving it too.
Again got a better suggestion for reporting tmwc? My opinion of tmwc members etc... topic post it here.

[Altus Institute]

With all due respect, I used the word stupid once, and I have apologized for doing so!

Yes you right prsm, but if i said it several time it was as example in the discussion i had with someone else.
I tried to say to SriNitayanda to read my previous post but he enjoyed particulary the situation to put everything up side down and to ask me again and again and again.
And his back up came to say that i spammed the forum.
Its was a little game of them.

Sorry for all these quotes, and all honor for you. Its good to see that some ppl realize their mistake and want to apologize and change their way of acting.
Im not a supporter, i dont even know Adrena, but as a person/player i know that he/she not someone who want to bring bad in game. Of course you are not a babysitter, but some players need help to stop acting wrong, ban them of something they cant understand will not help them to change their acts.
But sometimes, its takes time....and sometime we dont have times.


I dont said tmwc/dev are bad, i said dont insult the community members its all.
Its for that SriNitayanda dont mind that i can insult him, because he came the first insulting me......and after he played the big prince.....i allow you to insult me he said
And even if someone is not a dev member, tmwc doesnt have to tell that he is a troll because he doesnt follow tmwc orders.
We are not member of some dictatorships dream.

Artists are here, but they are not allowed by the tmwc to put their idea in game because they dont follow tmwc schedule.
I dont say all idea are good to put in game...make the difference.

[blackrazor]

If you think there was a mistreatment by some members of tmwc towards you, bring it up to us, yes we all work in the same team but we are individuals. We'll consider it, if there was a mistreatment, we'll try to improve.
Consider this topic reporting tmwc for mistreatment, whether its a reasonable report or not. Got a better idea? this is the 3rd new thread with similar topic being opened in the last 3 days. I don't see where it fits more, so i am moving it too.
Again got a better suggestion for reporting tmwc? My opinion of tmwc members etc... topic post it here.

Yes, I have a better idea.

1) Let Crush do his work as forum admin, he was always best at it.

2) Make your own "garbage can flamewar topic" or maybe an entire section in the forums to move the threads you don't like into, so you can squelch dissent that way, if you feel you must. But leave Crush's topic for its intended purpose of protesting the Server-move and the resulting back-stabbing / mutiny / putsch of Platyna, as was Crush's original intention. Out of respect for Crush, don't modify this topic's purpose in any way. Crush promised it would never be deleted (which includes diluted / inundated with unrelated garbage), so please respect his words.

Also, my thread doesn't belong in here. It legitimately is asking you people to please leave Crush's thread alone and find some other creative way to satisfy your need to pretend that everyone agrees with you. Platyna was never this bad to the players, congratulations, you have surpassed her. I hope you're proud of yourselves.

[TeZeR.D]

TBH, I think GM's should only moderate ingame.

[SriNitayanda]

If you think there was a mistreatment by some members of tmwc towards you, bring it up to us, yes we all work in the same team but we are individuals. We'll consider it, if there was a mistreatment, we'll try to improve.
Consider this topic reporting tmwc for mistreatment, whether its a reasonable report or not. Got a better idea? this is the 3rd new thread with similar topic being opened in the last 3 days. I don't see where it fits more, so i am moving it too.
Again got a better suggestion for reporting tmwc? My opinion of tmwc members etc... topic post it here.

Yes, I have a better idea.

1) Let Crush do his work as forum admin, he was always best at it.

2) Make your own "garbage can flamewar topic" or maybe an entire section in the forums to move the threads you don't like into, so you can squelch dissent that way, if you feel you must. But leave Crush's topic for its intended purpose of protesting the Server-move and the resulting back-stabbing / mutiny / putsch of Platyna, as was Crush's original intention. Out of respect for Crush, don't modify this topic's purpose in any way. Crush promised it would never be deleted (which includes diluted / inundated with unrelated garbage), so please respect his words.

Also, my thread doesn't belong in here. It legitimately is asking you people to please leave Crush's thread alone and find some other creative way to satisfy your need to pretend that everyone agrees with you. Platyna was never this bad to the players, congratulations, you have surpassed her. I hope you're proud of yourselves.

Hi blackrazor, how was your day? mine was gr8 thanks for asking, but you know i didn't spend my day complaining about people who manage a game i don't even play anymore.
Were you elected to decide about moderation? How are you so sure crush would have handle it differently? do even got an idea about the people we moderate past? If crush would think we don't do a good job he can contact us. Pretending that everyone agrees with us, thats a nice one, its always the same people who don't agree with us, no matter who is a part of tmwc, no matter what action we take. So it makes me think its more of personal issue of them, rather than the actions we take.
The posts will never be deleted i promise you, this is your mailbox for complaints ok? Remember it got nothing to do with the server move but you had to mention Platyna. So maybe we'll split it and maybe we won't.
Can we improve? sure we can, but you the usual complainers should improve too, if your tactic is posting your complaints on the forums once every few months and you see no change, maybe its time to change tactic?

GM's always moderated player talk and court house in the past.
Devs always moderated the development section.
We keep it the way it was. Think i did a bad job? I try to improve i promise you, worse than Platyna, hmm no i don't shut people up. roll back and see the insults she showered on everyone who disagree's, or just look in the GM logs and see the language she used towards the players during her events. But i guess its the nostalgia feeling that play tricks on you.
Every project got a complaints box, consider this topic complaint box, you can always PM or have a chat with a GM or any other TMWC on irc or in game. You can upload the log here afterwards if its important to you to make it public. Like i did when i disagreed with the boobs change.

[blackrazor]

It's very simple SirNit. My post didn't break any rules. It was a valid post, made in the appropriate section, with a valid complaint. You had zero right to arbitrarily dump it into your "complaints mailbox" which you inappropriately expropriated from Crush. Yes, you were elected, to be a GM who enforces the rules, not a rubber-stamper who covers for your TMWC Wushin-skygen buddy. You broke the rules by dumping my post into your garbage can, so go sanction yourself.

I have said many positive things too. Go search, I was positive, when it was deserved. But you only know how to read negative things. I say negative when I feel it is deserved, too. And right now, you and Wushin disappoint me more than Platyna ever has, and that is a fact.

I was right about frost and o11c. And just watch, I'll turn out right about this, too. Here's another fun fact for you to chew on. This game had the most players when the devs and Platyna were able to be adults and work together under her administration, in spite of their differences. Most players equals successful game. It's all gone downhill from there, and yeah, it can be painful at times to watch, but I am allowed to choose to watch it, rather than go hide under a rock and pretend it's not happening.

P.S. I'm sure Crush wouldn't have done it, because he didn't do it. He fights his own battles; he doesn't get others to do it for him. That's not his style.

P.P.S. I mentioned Platyna only in my reply to you, in this thread. My original post, to Wushin, had zero mention of Platyna or the server move.

P.P.P.S. I made a version 2.0 of my request, filled only with nice and positive language, as a genuine constructive request not to use Crush's thread in this new way. Let's see what you and wushin do with that one.