The Warrior Class

[Crush]

Totally agree with mrgrey on lowering stats on armor we have at the moment to bring more armor in game. But the problem is we have no active artists and no armor to replace it with/quests/scripts.

Regards,

The sprites for chainmail, light platemail and warlord plate are all recolorable. They all could be used for three or four different color-swaps (bronze, iron, steel, unobtanium). There is also the unreleased assassins gear and snakeskin armor.

[Chicka-Maria]

Totally agree with mrgrey on lowering stats on armor we have at the moment to bring more armor in game. But the problem is we have no active artists and no armor to replace it with/quests/scripts.

Regards,

The sprites for chainmail, light platemail and warlord plate are all recolorable. They all could be used for three or four different color-swaps (bronze, iron, steel, unobtanium). There is also the unreleased assassins gear and snakeskin armor.

True, but we dont have those scripted. The bronze, silver, steel etc. armor was suggested before just nobody bothered with it since they didnt want to "just recolor". This would also mean making items to suit the quest unless we plan to recolor the iron ore as well.

Regards,

[mistergrey]

There are many other ways those quests can be done, without a need for the same old "fetch this many ores, coals, etc, and I'll make you some neat armor"... We could for instance, have a small town on the snow continent where gp is not used, but credit. You could gain credit for doing generic small quests for the town's NPCs, and use that credit to buy things from the town shop. If you added a limit, making the town quests like the daily quests, that would be an interesting way of doing it.

Really though, the possibilities are endless

[Crush]

Not every item must be obtained with a quest. What's wrong with having them for sale in a normal NPC store?

[Kazenawa]

Not every item must be obtained with a quest. What's wrong with having them for sale in a normal NPC store?

I like this idea. It'd change. But wouldn't it be too quick for high level players to get it ?
Also, if you increase the selling price of needed items it'll be very long for new players to get it no ?
Though, i admit that a complete warlord suit is long to get with your first char, then it wouldn't change that much.

To make it as long for new players and high leveled ones, i thought about some new monters that drops the required items very rarely. If monsters aren't too difficult to fight, it'd let a chance to new players to get the items too.
Though, i know that if the armor suit you're thinking for is better than the warlord suit, not every low level player should be able to get it too easily...

We could for instance, have a small town on the snow continent where gp is not used, but credit. You could gain credit for doing generic small quests for the town's NPCs, and use that credit to buy things from the town shop.

I like the idea, it'd change a lot too.

If you added a limit, making the town quests like the daily quests, that would be an interesting way of doing it.

But this way, it'd only be a matter of time no ?

Really though, the possibilities are endless

What a wise speak ! I agree, it's only limited by imagination, but with many people's imagination, it endless

[Chicka-Maria]

Not every item must be obtained with a quest. What's wrong with having them for sale in a normal NPC store?

that was said about the warlord plates being sold in the shop before, if this is the case i suggest the prices go higher than before but not as much as the rings quest. 450-500k for a warlord plate seems reasonable from a shop in my opinion.

Remember we dont have anything to use the boss points from candor yet *hint hint*winkwink*

Regards,

[Big Crunch]

Not every item must be obtained with a quest. What's wrong with having them for sale in a normal NPC store?

that was said about the warlord plates being sold in the shop before, if this is the case i suggest the prices go higher than before but not as much as the rings quest. 450-500k for a warlord plate seems reasonable from a shop in my opinion.

Remember we dont have anything to use the boss points from candor yet *hint hint*winkwink*

Regards,

actually that's a great idea. use boss points for special items, or a combination of money and boss points

[Chicka-Maria]

yeah it would be pretty interesting if you can shop with boss points at a special armoury instead of gold pieces.

[blackrazor]

Regarding both warrior and the armor, I think both are relatively balanced for what the game is currently. I think a more apt question is to ask what you expect of the classes in the game. Right now, that "broken" armor is the only way for warrior to accomplish, at range one, what the mage and archer accomplish at further range, i.e., avoiding a lot, but not all, damage.

Comparisons to Ragnarok are sort of unfair, since while armor is lower there, warriors have 50K hitpoints or more, and a vast array of skills, to deal with mobs in that game. It's just a completely different experience.

Currently, Mages cannot effectively cast spells while wearing all but the lightest armor. You could certainly make the heavy metal armors also un-usable while equipping a bow. That would leave heavy armor the sole province of the warrior tank. Since he attacks at range one, and tanks for the team, it makes sense that he needs protection.

If you insist on lowering armor, other things may need to change also, or else risk having warrior become an unplayable class (compared to the other classes, especially archer). Perhaps change the Vit focus skill, since resist poison is sort of useless for high vit + luck tanks (poison immunity 100 = vit + (luk/3)). Maybe change that Vit skill to have the extra defence that you would be removing from armor. Also, as Raging is a +crit skill, maybe it makes more sense to base it off of Luk, which is the +crit stat. Perhaps add a +melee dmg focus that you can base off of strength, instead.


I'm currently working towards my first set of warlord equip, and it is a real grind. I heard it used to be easier to get these items, but right now, for a character starting out, it's a big task. The idea of adding even more grind for even better items might at first appeal to those who are bored and have already exhausted all the current content in the game. But I think a better use of development effort would be to add things, end-game, to do with what we already have.

Maybe add some sort of castle wars, or capture the flag for the pvp inclined. And more fashion items, crafting, tailoring, layers of clothing in the paperdoll, etc for the fashionistas. More bosses for the PvE crowd. Maybe player houses, gardens, and shops.

Those are my two cents. Overall, I like to explore and do new things. Grinding more and more is what I find most broken, in my opinion.

[ZdlN]

Not every item must be obtained with a quest. What's wrong with having them for sale in a normal NPC store?

Yellow and red slimes and bats are already on the Red List of Threatened Species - so maybe it is not the best way to sent the players to make more money...

[Crush]

Not every item must be obtained with a quest. What's wrong with having them for sale in a normal NPC store?

Yellow and red slimes and bats are already on the Red List of Threatened Species - so maybe it is not the best way to sent the players to make more money...

Turning another monster type into a cash cow is just a matter of changing a few numbers in mob_db.txt and item_db.txt.

[ZdlN]

Oh, i did not expect that you propose this. ^^ Then it is not as much work as mrgrey's idea (also if his idea i think is more fun - i also prefer quests)

But Crush's way would not change much while the best armor is already in a NPC store ... so, why not?

[sango98]

I hope it helps them a bit .

[Doofus]

Warriors have to balance their points over a wider range of skills to work effectively and having strong armour helps alleviate the need for pumping points into vitality. Another issue is that for many with low bandwidth, playing the maneuvering game as a ranged character results in frequent deaths and so warrior is the only feasible class for them.

Real balance (at least in the damage) can be achieved taking away some of the bow damage, eliminating potions and taking more than 50% of the ingrav damage. So, kill the game to have balance

I agree that if modifications are done to the warrior class there should be corresponding modifications to the other classes. E.g. it would be more realistic if an archer had a dexterity penalty (or opponent had a dodge bonus) when attacking adjacent monsters/targets (a moving object at range only requires minor corrections to hit but an agile target that is right on you is near impossible).

You could certainly make the heavy metal armors also un-usable while equipping a bow. That would leave heavy armor the sole province of the warrior tank.

It's quite a fair idea. Another option is to affect this indirectly. E.g. realistically, armour inhibits ones movement so why not have either a negative dexterity modifier or cap dexterity in which case an archer would opt for lighter more uninhibiting armour.
Another possibility is to divide up damage types into melee and ranged as well as the existing magical. E.g. chainmail would provide excellent melee resistance but very little ranged defence.
Also what about the enemy balance. At the moment all monsters are virtually entirely melee based and strategically it is natural to favour ranged based classes to combat them. More ranged based monsters would be good particularly magical against which the warlord plate would be inefective. In this case further armour development might take the form of sockets for various wards in the armour.

I guess they all require a lot of work to implement (and there are plenty of cons even for the warrior in what I've mentioned) but I largely see the archer class as having greater possibility for change.

[o11c]

E.g. it would be more realistic if an archer had a dexterity penalty (or opponent had a dodge bonus) when attacking adjacent monsters/targets (a moving object at range only requires minor corrections to hit but an agile target that is right on you is near impossible).

Currently this is done for damage. It's actually implemented as a bonus of up to about 31.25% if the enemy is more than 2 tiles away.

Code: Select all

src/map/battle.cpp-2820-    if (sd->attackrange > 2)
src/map/battle.cpp-2821-    {                           // [fate] ranged weapon?
src/map/battle.cpp:2822:        const int range_damage_bonus = 80;  // up to 31.25% bonus for long-range hit
src/map/battle.cpp-2823-        damage =
src/map/battle.cpp-2824-            damage * (256 +
src/map/battle.cpp:2825:                      ((range_damage_bonus * target_distance) /
src/map/battle.cpp-2826-                       sd->attackrange)) >> 8;
src/map/battle.cpp-2827-        damage2 =
src/map/battle.cpp-2828-            damage2 * (256 +
src/map/battle.cpp:2829:                       ((range_damage_bonus * target_distance) /
src/map/battle.cpp-2830-                        sd->attackrange)) >> 8;
src/map/battle.cpp-2831-    }