The official server flamewar topic

[blackrazor]

I look forward to the day when Wushin and Cassy go the way of Frost and o11c.

Basically you are saying that I should be nice to someone who treats me bad, spreads stupid rumours about me, insults and tricks me.
Sorry, but you can't except me to play someone's fool that hard.
I'm a very helpful and also patient person, same in my real life job where I have to deal with difficult customers, but there's always a line.

Btw why Frost? Are you confusing something there?

I meme-ed you with your own meme. How does it feel?

[blackrazor]

So you go arguing about this forever ? I there any stop to it ? Stop or no, platyna would never be in control like before. The best she can do is be a member of TMWC where i understand each gets one vote. Maybe she can take revenge. Make the original server lot better with more quests, items. Then all players will play there. That's the only way she can kickass. This is my last post in this thread.

You keep answering with tangential replies. No one is asking for Platyna's return. I am saying that you, as a Wushin apologist, could just as easily be a Platyna apologist, with the same words. I am pointing out the problem with your argument. I also mentioned Frost, o11c, and heck even Nixon, but you only hear Platyna, Platyna, Platyna. Stop wearing Platyna colored glasses, maybe?

Also, this issue got resolved the night before, between SirNit and I. It was settled respectfully, perhaps even amicably. But Wushin had to go starting it up again the next day. Wushin creates his own challenges to fight against. His abrasive arrogant way of handling things is its own reward.

P.S. Both Prsm and SirNit know how to stop flames, each with a better management style of their own, when they so desire. Maybe go ask them how it is done?

[blackrazor]

Netiquette Enforcement Officials caution forum users on the dangers of arming themselves with memes if not properly trained in their use. It is more likely than not, that a poorly trained meme-er will wind up getting meme-ed with their own meme in a flame-by trolling gone wrong.

[blackrazor]

... we know what kind of steaming piles play/played this game.

[Altus Institute]

Basically you are saying that I should be nice to someone who treats me bad, spreads stupid rumours about me, insults and tricks me.
Sorry, but you can't except me to play someone's fool that hard.

Oh oh....
I missed something or we all talked about the same things?
You started to match with the topic cassy?
Welcome to the steaming piles world....please have a sit.
And introduce yourself...
Hello im Cassy and...

I'm a very helpful and also patient person, same in my real life job where I have to deal with difficult customers, but there's always a line.

Wushin did the same.
He insulted ppl.
Ppl said dont do this.
And he said, i did this, i did that....im helpful.
what is your issues buddies?

ps : how cute the poo is blackrazor....do you have one in 16*16 png, i want it for my party in game named "steaming piles". plz tell me. Ofc it need to have free license.

[Platyna]

that is one view, Adrena brought up she wanted Platyna back in charge.
He also brought up two issues, one on a spell, the other on speaking english in public.
Prsm

After several years players are demaning me back, and it is still not a hint for you all to think about it.

[blackrazor]

that is one view, Adrena brought up she wanted Platyna back in charge.
He also brought up two issues, one on a spell, the other on speaking english in public.
Prsm

After several years players are demaning me back, and it is still not a hint for you all to think about it.

Personally I would rather Platyna, and not silly pleading on Patron and Paypal viewtopic.php?f=1&t=19137 to keep the server running.

Plus, Platyna kept the rest of the staff humble. They all claim miserable, but I saw humble! Ever since the move, many of their egos run wild and they take it out on players (and occasionally each other) who cross them when they grow BORED and frustrated with the inevitable results of their own decisions. Personally, as a player, I never ever had any problem with Platyna, nor did I hear a single bad thing nor any complaint at all when I played actively in 2007, 2008, 2009. Go look at my posts from back then; I never had reason to complain, and I never did, prior to the move.

In fact, if you read old posts, many credited Platyna with single-handedly saving this game by providing structure (rules guidance), free hosting, free admin at a time when Elven and Bjorn lost interest because the playerbase wanted eAthena (what they knew, and what existed as a functioning game) as opposed to ... ummmm ... hahahaha ... ManaServ (what didn't exist for years, and even now quite unfeatured and bare-boned). So Bjorn and Elven wanted to develop something new and cool and didn't care if zero players were around. And Platyna was always the player advocate, looking out for player needs, and eAthena, while buggy and ugly, was actually something that could and did support a game and community. And that is the same game, forums, community, and data files that we still have today. Thank you Platyna.

In the past couple years, I used to support Platyna less obviously, out of respect for the TMWC, and in the hopes that their EGO problems would die down after Frost and o11c departed. But I was wrong. Whomever is in charge will inevitably have EGO, and of all the people I have seen display their EGO, I find Platyna by far to be the most adult and I like hers best. This is my personal opinion, as a PLAYER (YES, we 99% count too, thank you) based on the years I have spent playing and also watching staff behavior on the forums and game.

The current staff, many of them, always come back to that same old tired argument: "What have you done for the game? Have you developed? Been elected GM? NO? Then no opinion for you if we don't like it!" They sound like the rich elite 1%: "Have you owned a company? Created jobs? NO? Then no opinion for you if we don't like it!" Here's the thing, players support the game just by playing and existing. No players? No community! With no players, all of this might as well just be a dead repository on Github. As with Manaserv. And Platyna always understood that. She always put the players and the play FIRST ! And I like that.

Any staff with these elitist attitudes are really in the wrong game. This is an open source community driven project. The elitists should go off and make their own PRIVATE game with pay (Patron/Paypal) components where they can be lords and ladies to boss around those they don't like, and leave us ordinary players to enjoy our little eclectic community such as it is.

[Altus Institute]

Personally I would rather Platyna, and not silly pleading on Patron and Paypal to keep the server running.

Im totally agree with you on this point.
I talked about several others point in my thread "microsoft spirit is over tmw". Before they delete it to put it in a thread that they consider as a garbage.
So lets talk from their garbage.

The same runs for the mana+ client, from an opensource project, they make the original unusable with the current server, and now you can use chrome to play tmw, but chrome is not from an opensource project.
So now if someone is not happy with 4144 decision, what we could do?
We have no free client to play tmw
And if the community claim about a client with all features to play, what 4144 will say?
No its mine and under copyright.
Ty for your contribution to the mana world

Every steps from the tmwc leads the game into the private owners hands.
Its simple and crystal clear.
They despise the community, unable them to talk on every subject they can.
Why there is a "player talk" subforum?
To talk how about marvellous, awesome and neat are the tmwc decisions?

Here the call, please someone remove the project from the tmwc hands and leads the tmw community into some fresh and delight lands where the project can rise up again from the trash in where it is at this moment.
TY

Plus, Platyna kept the rest of the staff humble. They all claim miserable, but I saw humble! Ever since the move, many of their egos run wild and they take it out on players (and occasionally each other) who cross them when they grow BORED and frustrated with the inevitable results of their own decisions.

Ah, they took back the golden warlord armor under tmwc decision, while they planning to remove the level raise up from the main christmas quest.
All for us, nothing for you.
They dont add "rare" in game because some of the tmwc dont want and want to keep them all, they just want to add some under control.
And ofc if a new player dont know how its works some vampire buy the rare they won for nothing while they sell for a lot of gp.
"How to keep rare under control and make gp in tmw" The best tmwc book to not put in all hands.

The current staff, many of them, always come back to that same old tired argument: "What have you done for the game? Have you developed? Been elected GM? NO? Then no opinion for you if we don't like it!"

Dictactors are always the same, they change their face but the spirit is always the same, and nowadays they use words like love you, sweety, my friends, kitty, im useful....like if we cant see them.

Any staff with these elitist attitudes are really in the wrong game. This is an open source community driven project. The elitists should go off and make their own PRIVATE game with pay (Patron/Paypal) components where they can be lords and ladies to boss around those they don't like, and leave us ordinary players to enjoy our little eclectic community such as it is.

You are right but they cant do this.
Why?
Because every private business is build on something originally free.
They dont have the mind to build something on their own.
And they want those who can working for them, and doing what they want not what ppl are capable...they call this : free world.
They can only take something free and turn it something private (with lies, lobby...)
So like they do in real, they do it in the game, they do it for the project.

The true name for ppl who act like this is parasite.
They bring illness by the despicable.
They change safe and free and original by sick and payable and rare.
They eat everything like if someone else will take it from them while there is enough for everybodies.
They make ppl think they are strong, but the truth is they are weak, because they works on our back saying we are good for nothing.

They finally want to change our originally free world for a fake one.
This will not happens.


ty to make my day so wonderful.

[blackrazor]

Altus, I am very sympathetic to everything you wrote, except surrounding one detail. Regarding 4144. he has never shown ego (unlike o11c which had ego overflow many times). 4144 also works very hard, creating new things that work well, and not just taking the free and making it not free. I never ever see 4144 argue or troll players. Originally, 4144's client was meant for another game which was a free fork from this project. But, the demand for it in TMW was so high by players, and most players had already found a way to use it here (which is allowed by the opensource rules for players to use the client they prefer), so eventually it was adopted for use here. The original Mana-client should also have been kept, but maybe there were compatibility issues that prevented it, over time, as more 4144-client features were adopted serverside. One could say, well then, update Mana-client, but I don't think there was anyone willing to volunteer their time for that when 4144-client was already here and working so much better, honestly from all his tireless hard work. And I remember that most players did prefer to use 4144-client over the Mana-client, especially the power-players (players that played a lot and with high efficiency), and since they were all already using it anyways, that paved the way for it's adoption.

[SriNitayanda]

This is my personal opinion, as a PLAYER (YES, we 99% count too, thank you) based on the years I have spent playing and also atching staff behavior on the forums and game.

You don't like the move we get it, we got it back in 2013, you keep rehashing it over and over, no wonder people got bored of you. now for the lol's, are you a player at all? when was the last time you played? are you the 99%? LOL! i see 1 active player with similar opinion to yours. don't you think that if other people thought like you do they would also comment? don't you think its better to know the experience of players in game before making a judgement? idk seems to me like it shows something about your EGO!
You keep making analogies to state politics, this is not a state, show us other open source project/games that run like a state.
Yes other good games take into account feedback of players, we try to do it as much as we can too. There is a difference between making constructive critics and complaining 100% of the time about the management. when you have valid points i don't mind taking them into account (did you notice wushin is less active in moderating the forums?). but when you keep rehashing the same arguments and think you represent a block of players when you don't even play... well sorry but we are not going to take you seriously. (try it in other projects see how seriously they take you)
Many open source projects take donations, look at the donations they mostly come from the tmwc members, we moved the server to paid host in order to separate host from admins. This way if the admin leaves, the project won't die. The donations are clearly not for profit but to maintain the current server.
Now for more lol's (platyna was the most adult admin ever):

[2009-10-31 21:46:15] 009-1.gat(58,37) Platyna : @broadcast Come on pussy pants, 10 you can do. ;p
[2009-11-11 22:26:31] 009-1.gat(58,41) Platyna : @broadcast BTW this is Platyna's reality. Bitching = no more events of this kind in the future.
[2009-12-23 23:07:16] 009-1.gat(58,41) Platyna : @broadcast In nomine dei nostri Satanas luciferi excelsi. ;->
[2009-12-23 23:10:22] 009-1.gat(58,41) Platyna : @broadcast BTW, ancient Romans had a better approach for Christmas, they called it Saturnalia, drunkt to death and ****ed everything that moves, including ***** *** and *****.
[2009-12-23 23:12:58] 009-1.gat(58,41) Platyna : @broadcast Some people suggest me here, to drink some iron potions and Duck some moubos, they are like made for such kind of usage - you can hold them by those ears...
[2009-12-23 23:15:37] 008-1.gat(80,88) Platyna : @broadcast come on fatties, with me.
[2009-12-23 23:16:25] 008-1.gat(78,96) Platyna : @broadcast Come come.
[2009-12-23 23:17:01] 008-1.gat(78,96) Platyna : @broadcast I am south of soul menhir.
[2009-12-23 23:18:27] 008-1.gat(78,98) Platyna : @spawn mouboo 50
[2009-12-23 23:19:02] 008-1.gat(78,98) Platyna : @broadcast Remember, grab them by the ears...

[2010-01-22 00:30:12] 009-1.gat(58,40) Platyna : @broadcast BTW, I connected creationist detection script to the server. Each creationist detected will be banned automagicaly, so they can then pray to Jesus for some miracles.
[2010-02-04 17:07:15] 009-1.gat(58,41) Platyna : @broadcast People PM me about items and I do wipe all your inventory...
[2010-02-14 21:49:42] 008-1.gat(78,45) Platyna : @broadcast Aw...little girls from elementary schools can get those, and you don't?
[2010-03-03 20:42:35] 009-1.gat(57,40) Platyna : @broadcast Of, call it, lazy people who has nothing to do than play computer games. :]
[2010-05-22 13:56:16] 007-1.gat(68,56) Platyna : @broadcast Come to the party, girls are waiting. ;>
[2010-05-22 13:56:41] 007-1.gat(68,56) Platyna : @broadcast Most of them ugly like hel but some beer can easly fix it.
etc... (there is a lot more, in the gm logs, in irc chat logs, here on forums, and private convo's)

When we do it and say we will change, you don't give us a chance, if you tried to do it with Platyna she will either shut you up or ban you... but i guess its the nostalgia feeling that keeps playing tricks on you. We are willing to accept relevant critic, but we are bored of your arguments when you clearly don't know what you are talking about.

[blackrazor]

You don't like the move we get it, we got it back in 2013, you keep rehashing it over and over, no wonder people got bored of you. now for the lol's

Not the move. The EGOS, including yours. I'm rehashing it in the legal place for that. You don't like? Don't read.

Speaking of bored and lols, this is for you, prsm, cassy, and wu-wu:

[Altus Institute]

Originally, 4144's client was meant for another game which was a free fork from this project.

Ok, but im not talking about ego, im talking about the way where all the project goes.

----->wall.....space.....private owners development....end of tmw as opensource project.

Because you cant play tmw without a client, and the only client that exist is 4144 personal project.
So its related to where tmwc leads the other side of the project, and the alliance with chrome browser, dont let me think that is good for the project as opensource.

i see 1 active player with similar opinion to yours. don't you think that if other people thought like you do they would also comment?

why they will do it, knowing that they will be called troll on the forum and in game?
No possibility to buy or to win rare....
Only those who follow can...

You keep making analogies to state politics, this is not a state, show us other open source project/games that run like a state

what is the tmwc?
A meeting for a bunch of good friends bringing some food, drinks and cheerleaders, and having some fun for a couple of hours via skype??

There is a difference between making constructive critics and complaining 100% of the time about the management.

ah sorry but if something goes wrong what else we can do?
Talking to the general store?
Dont forget the leads did the same, not openly, they did it like a snake.
So why you dont take our open critics as constructive?
You dont even read them.
Critics bring you back some old days that you want to forget?

when you have valid points i don't mind taking them into account ... and think you represent a block of players when you don't even play... well sorry but we are not going to take you seriously.

Well good point, that means that you are not a serious team who think to the project.
You think about you in the project.
So how can you take you seriously?

Many open source projects take donations

of course they do.
But i didnt see an opensource project who have everything free moving to pay fees.

look at the donations they mostly come from the tmwc members, we moved the server to paid host in order to separate host from admins. This way if the admin leaves, the project won't die. The donations are clearly not for profit but to maintain the current server.

they just try to fix what they have done, so we must take them as saviors?
They just save their ass from a hot and bad situation in which they bring the project.
Please stop to make donation....to see the result....just to laugh....

Now for more lol's (platyna was the most adult admin ever):

Seems they have some fun, and at this time nobody cried.
Everyone was happy to play only a bunch was hungry to not have what they want, and they leads the project where it is now.
Do you remember SriNitayanda that you called ppl 'troll' in game?

Everyone dont care about it, because they just want to take what they can at this moment.
So it was the same for Platyna's time.
Dont just go to find some pearls, taking them out of the context.
as reminder, you hate trolls, you dont take them seriously.
For wushin players are steaming piles, i dont make a picture for you.
And you broadcast in game Trolls are trolling?
Man you are not serious.
Or you dont know what you trying to say.

[2009-12-23 23:07:16] 009-1.gat(58,41) Platyna : @broadcast In nomine dei nostri Satanas luciferi excelsi. ;->
[2009-12-23 23:10:22] 009-1.gat(58,41) Platyna : @broadcast BTW, ancient Romans had a better approach for Christmas, they called it Saturnalia, drunkt to death and ****ed everything that moves, including ***** *** and *****.
[2010-01-22 00:30:12] 009-1.gat(58,40) Platyna : @broadcast BTW, I connected creationist detection script to the server. Each creationist detected will be banned automagicaly, so they can then pray to Jesus for some miracles.

What can we expect that someone who lead a game with zombie, skell and all the horrors this game can show?
I only see sick ppl who waiting to be delivered from their nightmare.
And at the moment dev continue on the same way....can we expect another behaviour from you?

[2010-03-03 20:42:35] 009-1.gat(57,40) Platyna : @broadcast Of, call it, lazy people who has nothing to do than play computer games. :]

A special like for this one, that remind me someone talking recently about community.

if you tried to do it with Platyna she will either shut you up or ban you... but i guess its the nostalgia feeling that keeps playing tricks on you.

another times another methods

We are willing to accept relevant critic.

Not really, you delete post, you move thread....if someone speak about something he is a troll....man i quote you, can we take you seriously?

[prsm]

The current staff, many of them, always come back to that same old tired argument: "What have you done for the game? Have you developed? Been elected GM? NO? Then no opinion for you if we don't like it!" They sound like the rich elite 1%: "Have you owned a company? Created jobs? NO? Then no opinion for you if we don't like it!" Here's the thing, players support the game just by playing and existing. No players? No community! With no players, all of this might as well just be a dead repository on Github. As with Manaserv. And Platyna always understood that. She always put the players and the play FIRST ! And I like that.

World leaders, religious leaders, sports leaders have all said since the beginning of time, "Actions speak louder than words", blackrazor says that's a tired old argument ...... this is why i get bored!

Also, the quote that Platyna used was originally 10 lines long that she edited to 2 to make her self look better, glad you referenced it.

Prsm

[Altus Institute]

World leaders, religious leaders, sports leaders have all said since the beginning of time, "Actions speak louder than words", Prsm

You right prsm, but the thoughts bring the action not the contrary.
you want to pee?
you go to pee!
you think before.
Its for that reason all these good guys leads the world in despair because they take their actions for their desire.
They are a little confused on what doing what.
Obviously you cant take your butt for your head, them yes, they did.

So if you have some bads thoughts.....what do you think will appear as action?

[prsm]

Obviously you cant take your butt for your head, them yes, they did.

i read this 6 times, doesn't mean a thing, senseless.

and wow, a urine reference, gotta be a first.