Redesigning the mana World

[enchilado]

It's been deemed by me that TM's W needs a bit of attention. We've got coders, we've got artists, we've got amateur mappers. The world's been drawn, sure, and has names. But what do they mean? What's the point of it all? Where's it going?

- Let's have a snow place, a forest place, a savanna place, and a noob island

- Sure

Well, I'm not liking this at all. It gets worse, though:

- Let's make all the people look the same, to save time, but we'll pretend the snow people are eskimos, the forest people are lumberjacks and the desert people are Arabian

- Sure

Eh, that's disgusting. Sure, it's not the final server, and it's barely even pre-alpha, but that's the time to get it done. Develop to fit the world, not fit the world to the development. So, here goes my project to design the entire world again, pretty much from scratch.

Devs, I don't want you to promise me you'll use it, but if you're absolutely sure you don't want this, please tell me.

Players, help with anything you want.

****************
Steps to a new world
****************

(follow these steps with each place, one landmass at a time)

1) Draw the coastlines
2) Add terrains
3) Write about the country - inports, exports, rulers, capitals and so on.
4) Add regions
5) Write about the regions
6) Add towns
7) Write about the towns

Keep adding more and more detail, until you have enough stuff that you know where your world will go. Of course, you can change anything at any time to fit with an idea you have.

So, that's what I'm going to do. Follow the link in my signature if you want to see the Wiki page, as well as the reasonably current world map (large, and getting larger).



Comments, please! Help, please! Thanks, please!

[Jaxad0127]

Feel free to try to redo content for eAthena. Content for ManaServ is already WIP.

[enchilado]

If, and where, can I see what's been done for ManaServ so far?

[stava]

I think there should be some less common maps.. Some unique areas, unique tiles..
-Aqua town?
-Hell?
-Moon?
-Dream World?
-Greek Island?
.
.
.
I think TMW really needs creative stuff..
Monsters are mostly tiny and look weak.. Why not making monsters that are larger than player? Bosses would be really great to have.
-My tauren is a good sample of my idea.
.
.
.
Trees should be bigger than your character, it irritates me on TMW to see tree my character size.. Probably because I am an artist and in my eyes that's a no no.. Also different types of trees:
-Some without leaves
-Some with different color of leaves
-Maybe some really big trees that you can enter
.
.
.
I've seen really good pixel artists here.. So why not using the talent you have maximally?

I'm probably not the one to tell you guys what to do, since I just started few days ago. Don't find my comment wrong, I was just trying to help out with the ideas to make TMW more interesting to play.

[Jaxad0127]

If, and where, can I see what's been done for ManaServ so far?

The TMW ManaServ forums and wiki articles (backstory and related).

[Rotonen]

Points 1-7 already worked on for years and somewhat done and we have a some sort of a sketch of which of the areas we are going to implement in which order in the CRs to come. Do read the wiki.

Anything else making your shoe too tight?

[Crush]

I don't want to rain on your parade, poison_ivy, but your project is pretty much doomed from the start when you try to do it as part of TMW. You are basically planning to replicate all the effort done for the Manaserv CRs and TMW developers will certainly not agree with you taking any development manpower from the CR projects.

But when you have so many fresh ideas why don't you create a new server from scratch or join the team of one of the TMW clone servers and help them becoming something original?

[enchilado]

Well, I haven't been on the Wiki in a while, but from what I've seen, the world is either

a) incomplete
b) poorly designed or
c) over-complete

By A, I mean that there were gaps, question marks, and 'proposed' labels all over the place.
By B, I mean that there was bullpoo about people made of plants and fire
By C, I mean that too much effort was put into the beginning of the world, which should not be explained.


I would like to change the maps slightly, and fit the human locations to the natural ones. I want to start with the evolution of humans and how they spread, so finding what languages are found where and so on. All this can be written in just a few paragraphs.

Then, a few pages on famous wars and kings and so on.

And finally, lots of pages about how the world is currently.


Shall I remake the current world map with layers and minor edits? I can look up existing towns and correct what I dislike and add new things. I can work out which monsters are found where.

I may be going over-realistic for a simple RPG, but as long as it's still fun, and doesn't require more effort on the part of the developers, what harm can it do? I have visions of very realistic worlds.

Also, the exports and imports of a country are important - what items can you find where? Maybe coal comes from hills in the southern continents. You need to travel there to acquire coal, for to make steel.

We don't want to be able to buy all the items from one shop!


PS (Crush posted):

It's to rain on my parade, Crush . I don't need to use fresh ideas, I just want to complete your world which is good, but needs a lot of work, IMO. And of course I don't want to control the development; I want to give the developers a world they like, a stock of ideas that they can use. If they want to.

[Jaxad0127]

Then please work with John P.

[Crush]

Then please work with John P.

Is that guy still around? I don't remember to have read read from him in ages.

[Jaxad0127]

Then please work with John P.

Is that guy still around? I don't remember to have read read from him in ages.

He recently put a good amount of text on the wiki: http://wiki.themanaworld.org/index.php? ... ldid=13191.

[enchilado]

Sure I will, John P does good stuff, but I also wasn't aware he was still here. I'll read what he's written

[kyon]

We've got coders, we've got artists, we've got amateur mappers.

I disagree. You have any actual numbers?

[bcs86]

It all boils down to work, competence, and motivation. The bad economy has forced many contributors to lay themselves off (except people from polend and sweeden who can afford to work for free).

Bad is always easy to find. Answers are not.

There's nothing I can do about NPCs all looking alike as much as I would like to change that before the next geologic epoch.

Steps for TMW sucess:

• Close your browser
• Close IRC client
• Log out of the game
• Get on food stamps
• Open your editors and PRAY (and believe and do)
• Post your work before you lose the internet and get evicted from your home.

[John P]

That guy John P works too much, but he thankfully is still employed.

You are right Ivy, there are articles that contradict each other. This will be the case as I ever-so-slowly transfer from eAthena story to Manaserv story. I leave proposal labels on texts so people like you feel more welcome to add to or change what is there (since really it isn't in the game yet and so not set in stone).

People tend to have different visions of what is "important" as far as storyline goes. For example, you would like to highlight import/exports like coal (although TMW seems pre-industrial to me) and "circle of economy". Rotonen I know has a desire to show the monster/animal food-chain or "circle of life". I wanted to emphasize the importance of the mana and how/why it works, just as a science fiction writer shows his worth by explaining his science.

I say this is a wiki, we can describe every blade of grass if we care to.

As far as detailing the world, I have left far off details quite vague because, with this particular project, contributors are not 100% reliable all of the time (since it is a "hobby" game), so I give way to the graphics first, although I will be told by you and others that I shouldn't. I can more easily design a world around the art, than expect an artist to design to my (however explicit) verbal descriptions. They drew a map, then I told a story. I have had to re-write a few stories that were made before the world was created, only to end up not fitting. It isn't as fun.

My plan with backstory and lore is such that when quests are designed, they can attach to the lore and thus be more story-driven. For example, the Dark Figure of the Death Realm is implicitly a major character of the Creation story. Tritans will have tension with Keshlam supporters (and thus, likely you) because of the history. Ideally, each geography page will be divided into "lore/history" and "gameplay".

I'd love any help, though. Any discussion of kings and economy or whatever is welcome. However, I don't see why you have to throw away the map (or anything else) that is already created in order to do it. Let me know if you have any specific questions or thoughts, because I have many plans that have not yet had time to make it to articles.

P.S. - For your pleasure, I hope CR-2 will show the introduction of the finned, blue-colored, underwater Tritan race. In the FAR future, you should be able to visit their under-sea world.