Discussion about BOT activity

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renatov
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Discussion about BOT activity

Post by renatov »

Hello everybody, I've seen some BOT activity lately. I searched the forum and I've found that It seems to be a recurrent problem. I would like to propose a discussion about this issue, so we could share our thoughts about why people are doing this and what could be done to prevent or to make this activity becoming unnecessary. I hope that this discussion brings improvements to the game.

My point of view is that people use bot because the game is too mechanic and repetitive. If the game became more interactive and if it demanded more creative actions from its players, the probability that people would use bot should be lowered.

I'm not trying to defend the trespassers nor to say that what they have been doing is right. But as a behavioral psychology student, I must say that all living organisms (including human beings) react and try to adapt to their environment. If this environment demands a bot, them people will use it, despite what the rules are, because a "rule" is only a part of this environment, it's just one contigency that establishes and maintains people behavior. Unfortunately, it's largely known in psychology that only a "rule" by itself is not enough to keep people doing what they are expected to do. As a consequence to TMW, decreeing game rules will not be sufficient.

I also noticed that the community is trying to deal with this deviant behavior with punitive solutions. In my oppinion, char resets, bans and whatever punitive contigencies you may artificially try to sustain will not lower bot activity to a satisfactory level, it will only raise the frequency of avoidance behavior, for example, bot improvement behavior. Again, it's well known in behavioral psychology that punishment isn't the most effective procedure to change people's behavior (and that's why punishment is never used as an intervention technique in behavioral psychotherapy).

I decided to post this because I'm concerned with the fact that TMW is reproducing the same mistakes that other MMORPGs have been doing (which is a comon sense way of dealing with human behavior), and as a consequence TMW will be handling this problem as uneffective as other games currently do (for example, Tibia).

Well, that's what I have to say for now, to start this discussion. Please post your thoughts and points of view.


PS: I tryed to find the best place to post this discussion; sorry if it's not in the right forum and please move it to a better place.
And as I lay there gazing at the sky
My body's numb and my throat is dry
And as I lay forgotten and alone
Without a tear I draw my parting groan.
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yubabax116
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Re: Discussion about BOT activity

Post by yubabax116 »

No matter what game you go to there will be activity like this, Even Teeworlds has a bot for shooting other players and you dont even need to recieve items for it. Its a MMORPG people get lazy and look for a simpler solution for themselves. As a Student (as you say) you should know this :) .
But if you think something magical will stop people from botting and automation then please feel free to try making a "perfect" Way for the game ;)

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Anonymous!!!
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Re: Discussion about BOT activity

Post by Anonymous!!! »

renatov wrote:My point of view is that people use bot because the game is too mechanic and repetitive
I give you full agreement.
I leveled to 81. It got wiped.
I got sick of leveling again at level 30 or 40 :P
The game needs a bit more interactiveness.
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Crush
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Re: Discussion about BOT activity

Post by Crush »

Do you have any suggestions how the game could be made more interactive?
  • former Manasource Programmer
  • former TMW Pixel artist
  • NOT a game master

Please do not send me any inquiries regarding player accounts on TMW.


You might have heard a certain rumor about me. This rumor is completely false. You might also have heard the other rumor about me. This rumor is 100% accurate.
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yourmistakes
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Re: Discussion about BOT activity

Post by yourmistakes »

contextual mini games
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renatov
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Re: Discussion about BOT activity

Post by renatov »

yubabax116 wrote:No matter what game you go to there will be activity like this, Even Teeworlds has a bot for shooting other players and you dont even need to recieve items for it. Its a MMORPG people get lazy and look for a simpler solution for themselves. As a Student (as you say) you should know this :) .
But if you think something magical will stop people from botting and automation then please feel free to try making a "perfect" Way for the game ;)

~Yubaba~
Hi, thanks for you reply. I think I was misunderstood (sorry for my English). I'm not talking about some comon sense formula, like "people are lazy" and "bad things happen, you know". Also, I was misunderstood in my proposal. There can't be any magic approach in behavioral issues, as there are no similar thing in any other serious area. I'm talking about an analysis/intervention based in Radical Behaviorism. What can be done is some data gathering for study and comparison with the specialized literature. But I don't know what the community thinks about all this, so I decided to open a discussion for people to express their thoughts :D

Maybe people don't care about bot activity, or even think it's ok, I don't know. And if that's the case, I would just lose my time trying to help in some issue that's not even a problem hehehe
And as I lay there gazing at the sky
My body's numb and my throat is dry
And as I lay forgotten and alone
Without a tear I draw my parting groan.
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renatov
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Re: Discussion about BOT activity

Post by renatov »

Crush wrote:Do you have any suggestions how the game could be made more interactive?
Not yet, I have to get to know the game better first. But I guess there could be implemented some strategies that Human Resources people currently use to keep workers productive and satisfied. Probably it would make the game experience more meaningful.

World of Warcraft makes use of this kind of thing, like some intermittent reinforcement combinations to sustain persistent behavior. (It doesn't surprise me that WoW is the most played game in the world)
And as I lay there gazing at the sky
My body's numb and my throat is dry
And as I lay forgotten and alone
Without a tear I draw my parting groan.
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Anonymous!!!
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Re: Discussion about BOT activity

Post by Anonymous!!! »

Crush wrote:Do you have any suggestions how the game could be made more interactive?
Lets see...
* Environment
* More quests
* Pushable objects
* PvP exp
* Crafting (for example a dialog where you get to add items and they merge... of course only certain ones would though but it'd be nice to be able to create something.)
* The ability to have other players invisible on a map
* Infinite maps
* Bonuses for long-time players
* Other ways to level:
* EXP from magic success.
* EXP transfer (Would be very useful for a mule I wouldn't like to use anymore)
* EXP from money or items.

Another thing I did on my server was make an NPC who lets you host a play, he announces it and you set the ticket cost... then at the end you get the ticket money.

Also... a Holiday mode would be nice so I could enable it and not get my characters wiped -_-
RIP Hamish

Although most of these cannot be done on eAthena.

Anyway back to the topic, I admit I've used and written bot scripts that work in this game and others but I can tell you the main cause for this is because the game got boring.
I started work on a bot that would give information to newbies and had advanced chat for when I was bored and wanted to talk.

In the end I had a chatbot I used on my server.
I ended up altering it's code and made an administrator bot that gave warnings/kicks for foul language and would record [WGM]s and it was able to react to WGM messages.

Anyway, I only ever started work on chatbots because the game got boring.
Grind grind grind... and quests are no better.

Code: Select all

mes "[Random NPC]";
mes "\"Please go and do 16 hours of grinding for me just because I want this item.\"";
close;
I suggest something in gameplay that DOESN'T involve grinding of any kind.
Such as a quiz NPC or something who can reward with EXP and that sort of stuff.
Or even a 'Guess my number' quest.

Please just no more grinding!!!

Well those are my thoughts...

Also the problem with bots... Well they steal normal player's kills and have an unfair advantage...
I suggest maybe let bots be free in one particular place with low monster spawns.
And then any other bot activity would be a ban.

There needs to be a crackdown on the major botters anyway.
My automations have been on silk worms and squirrels mainly while I'm scripting or whatever.
I suggest to just make a quest that you CAN'T bot in and give it a reward good as hell.
If you wanted to keep mobs involved then maybe I can script you lot a quest where the player is warped to some small map and they have to fight mobs for the prize but the NPC keeps giving them options...

Like for example:

Code: Select all

OnPetDeath:
     mes "[Warlord]";
     mes "\"I see you have defeated my monsters... I will now offer you 3 fights to pick from. Remember you must have 50 battle points to win the item. You currently have " + @BattlePoints + " battle points.\"";
    menu
            "10 Snakes [3 Points]",L_Snake_10,
            "5 Fallen [8 Points]",L_Fallen_5,
            "20 Red Slimes [2 Points]",L_Red_Slime_20,
            "I forfeit.",L_Quit;
-Nahem - My Characters in use are:
  • Nahem Image
  • Knetrin Image
  • Nullified Image
Are you up for a CHALLENGE? Yes!
Project Hurnscald
I'm currently attempting to develop an Event Arena and I'm looking for ideas!
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renatov
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Re: Discussion about BOT activity

Post by renatov »

It's a pity that this kind of discussion is neglected, the game experience could and should be improved. Or else players shall keep doing repetitive and tedious movements, using bots and giving up from playing after a while...
And as I lay there gazing at the sky
My body's numb and my throat is dry
And as I lay forgotten and alone
Without a tear I draw my parting groan.
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